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O idila cu probleme

ancudeu — Mon, 30 Nov 2009 18:02:42 +0000

Ba s-au certat…ba inca sunt impreuna…ba nici nu vor sa se vada…ba se intalnesc zilnic…s-ar putea spune ca e o relatie normala tipica Holywood-ului.

Reese Witherspoon(33 de ani) si Jake Gyllenhaal(28 de ani) au lucrat impreuna la filmul “Rendition”, de unde au si aparut zvonuri ca acestia si-au transpus iubirea din scenariu in viata reala, iar pana in vara anului 2008 deja cei doi au anuntat oficial ca sunt impreuna.

Cei doi par sa se potriveasca, amandoi sunt destul de linistiti si pare sa le placa sa-si petreaca timpul impreuna. Insa de ce tot apar zvonuri ca s-ar fi certat? Oare acest cuplu are de infruntat in primul rand gurile rele din jurul lor?

UK Ministers Surrender Mckinnon To US Kidnap

Peter Reynolds — Sun, 29 Nov 2009 14:44:00 +0000

It’s said that when Gordon Brown offered Alan Johnson the Home Office he rejected it as a pois

Afghans Detail Detention in ‘Black Jail’ at U.S. Base

norcaltruth — Sun, 29 Nov 2009 09:41:35 +0000

source: New York Times KABUL, Afghanistan — An American military detention camp in Afghanistan is st

Judge Orders Release of Algerian from Guantanamo

srsean1968 — Sat, 28 Nov 2009 11:13:26 +0000

Source: CampaignForLiberty By Andy Worthington Published 11/28/09 (But He’s Not Going Anywhere

Claim: Pentagon Tried to ‘Intimidate’ Journalist Covering Blackwater

srsean1968 — Fri, 27 Nov 2009 06:51:07 +0000

Source: RawStory By Daniel Tencer November 26th, 2009 The office of Adm. Mike Mullen, the chairman o

UK Judges Compare Binyam Mohamed’s Torture To That Of Abu Zubaydah by Andy Worthington

dandelionsalad — Thu, 26 Nov 2009 21:39:40 +0000

by Andy Worthington Featured Writer Dandelion Salad www.andyworthington.co.uk 26 November 2009 Binya

The Lady Who Makes Me Gag(a)

Jake — Thu, 26 Nov 2009 08:47:47 +0000

An 18 year old employee of mine asked me the most ridiculous question today, she rudely put forth, ” you don’t like Lady Gaga?” This young lass asked this question with such audacity and awe that I was forced to ponder the question, call it mental rendition. I answered with a pathetic “I guess she’s OK.” Complete fail, she’s OK? She’s agitating, she’s trendy, she’s terribly untalented, she’s somewhat sexy in the bestiality kind of way, but she’s not “OK.” After hitting up Natural High to peep Karma tonight I knew my preference for substance was not music nerdy or socially elite, it was a simple dismissal of terrible radio junk. Lady Gaga is the type of artist that ends up in a figurative garbage can, considering it’s Gaga, she may end up in a physical one to boot. I can’t think of a reasonable historic example to exemplify my point here, but 4 Non Blondes and Milli Vanilli come to mind for some reason. Either way, this YouTube character, Lord Gaga, is the kind of viral identity I would usually dismiss with a passive glance and a wave of the mouse. But this character hammers my proverbial nails in Lady Gaga’s coffin, I can’t help but stare awhile, and yes, free my mind from an unknown interrogation cell in Syria.

Check this video of Lady Gaga while she was still human and a student at NYU.

Boiling Frogs’ 09 Thanksgiving Note to the President

srsean1968 — Thu, 26 Nov 2009 01:51:35 +0000

Source: BoilingFrogs Tuesday, 24. November 2009 by Sibel Edmonds Freedom & Life: Of Turkeys

Former U.K. Ambassador Reveals CIA Rendition and Torture in prior Soviet State Uzbekistan

whitewraithe — Wed, 25 Nov 2009 05:11:13 +0000

Daniel Tencer 11-4-2009 rawstory.com The CIA relied on intelligence based on torture in prisons in U

Bagram: A living hell

rogerhollander — Wed, 25 Nov 2009 02:25:33 +0000

Friday 20 November 2009

Paddy McGuffin

www.morningstaronline.co.uk/

The US military has allowed journalists into its newly expanded secret detention centre at Bagram air base in Afghanistan this week.

The base has been described by campaigners as Guantanamo Bay’s “more evil twin” and the allegations of torture and murder within its secretive walls continue to this day.

The US claims this is proof of its determination to provide greater transparency and openness in its policy of extraordinary rendition and detention without trial.

The claim was somewhat undermined by the fact that the touring journalists had no access to the hundreds of inmates held at the facility.

Omar Deghayes is one man who has personal experience of both Bagram and Guantanamo. He was not impressed by US grandstanding.

He had seen it all before and has strong reason to doubt the announcement of improved conditions at Bagram.

Having suffered hellish torture there himself, he has now discovered that his brother-in-law has been detained at Bagram for the last two months and, if anything, he appears to have been treated even more brutally.

Deghayes was born in Libya in 1969. He was forced to flee the country with his mother and siblings after the torture and murder of his father by the Gadaffi regime.

Arriving in Brighton as a teenager, he went on to study law in Wolverhampton. The family were granted refugee status here in 1987.

In 2002 Deghayes was arrested in Pakistan and was “sold” to the US for a bounty. He was taken first to Bagram and then Guantanamo, where he was imprisoned without trial for five years.

During his time at Guantanamo he was blinded in one eye, which was already damaged since childhood, after guards repeatedly rubbed pepper spray in it.

The only “evidence” against him was a clip from an Islamic propaganda film showing Chechen fighters, one of which the US authorities claimed was him.

It later transpired that the image was not of Deghayes but of an Abu Walid, a Chechan rebel who had been killed some time in 2004.

Deghayes had in fact never been to Chechnya and had always maintained as much.

Speaking to the Morning Star, he gave his opinion on the US press tour of Bagram.

“This is how they manipulate things,” he says.

“I have experienced it personally at Guantanamo. They gave guided tours of the camp like it was a tour of the Himalayas or something.”

In 2002 a group of congressmen were given a guided tour of “Gitmo,” albeit a much sanitised one.

Following his tour of the facility Oklahoma Senator James Inhofe told CNN: “We are giving very good treatment to these people.

“Quite frankly, I personally think better than they deserve. We’re dealing with terrorists here.”

As if to complete the bizarre theme park atmosphere, each congressman was given a souvenir cap, a Guantanamo flag and a DVD of their visit to take home with them.

Select journalists were also given guided tours, reminiscent of this week’s at Bagram.

Human rights lawyer Clive Stafford Smith, who represented Deghayes and many other Guantanamo prisoners, notes in his invaluable book Bad Men that, for one tour, “there was a show block in camp four … there was a show interrogation cell in camp five, designed to make solitary confinement look like a private suite.”

He goes on to say that “various military personnel were wheeled out for interviews about one humanitarian highlight of the prison or another.

“Whenever an inconvenient question might arise, they could shelter politely behind the barricade of institutional security.”

Deghayes agrees. “Those on the tour, the congressmen and reporters were not allowed to meet the prisoners. They were shown all the new facilities and it was like a nice party for them.

“Then they went back and gave glowing reports about how good it all was there,” he says.

“It was only when a whistle-blower told the real story that they became aware of what it was really like.

“The Obama administration is just copying the same policy as Bush. It is the same bureaucrats giving the same camouflage and using the same deceptions.”

Asked what credence he gave to the US claims of improved conditions at Bagram, he stated: “My brother-in-law is in Bagram now.

“He was just picked up a few months ago. He went to visit his in-laws in Afghanistan and they arrested him.

“My sister was finally able to visit him and she said the conditions were even worse than when I was there.

“She said he was in very bad condition. His eyes and face were battered and bleeding. It is worse there now than it ever was.

“They are saying there are all these new facilities, but that is not the issue,” says Deghayes.

“The real issue is that they are subjecting people to brutal and inhuman torture.”

Perhaps the most perfidious aspect to the situation in Bagram is that the US has stated that Afghan nationals held there have no legal rights.

Foreign nationals held there are said to have “some” legal rights, but those imprisoned in their own country by an invading foreign power have none.

The only way to ensure the freedom of those who still suffer torture and indefinite imprisonment is for the people of the US, Britain and elsewhere to continue to campaign and vocally criticise the policy. This is something Deghayes is keen to emphasise.

“When Obama came into power it was under a mandate of closing Guantanamo and stopping these abuses, but he has not done it. He has not come up with any new system,” says Deghayes.

“There is no legal system, no court system in Guantanamo or Bagram.

“Everyone who has been released from either Guantanamo or Bagram has been released due to campaigning and pressure brought on their behalf, not by any legal system or by being found innocent. Many people have been told they should have been released but are still there.

“I know from personal experience that campaigning is the only thing that works and we will continue to campaign for the release of my brother-in-law and all the others.”

Bagram’s brutal record

Bagram air base is located 27 miles north of Kabul and is estimated to house in excess of 600 prisoners. The recent extension will bring the number of prisoners it can hold to over 1,000.

The reason for this extension of the facility is seen by many to indicate an intention to increase US troop numbers and presumably therefore prisoners in the region.

The base was originally used to process prisoners during the US-led invasion of Afghanistan in 2001 – part of Operation Enduring Freedom.

But since then Bagram has been filled with detainees held for years without charge, trial or legal rights.

Unlike Guantanamo where, after a hard-fought struggle, US lawyers have been granted access to detainees, those incarcerated in Bagram remain in a legal black hole.

Since 2002 there have been numerous reports of torture and at least two cases of murder.

In one of the worst cases a taxi driver by the name of Dilawar was beaten to death there in December 2002. His body was found to have suffered over 100 savage blows to the legs, apparently for the sadistic amusement of guards.

The autopsy report said that his legs had become “pulpified” and that he had died from blunt force trauma.

Omar Deghayes described his time at Bagram as follows: “Lying on the floor of the compound, all night I would hear the screams of others in the rooms above us as they were tortured and interrogated.

“My number would be called out and I would have to go to the gate. They chained me and put a bag over my head, dragging me off for my own turn.

“They would force me to my knees for questioning and threaten me with more torture.”

State Secrets Privilege: The Puppets & Puppet Masters

srsean1968 — Tue, 24 Nov 2009 11:42:10 +0000

Source: BoilingFrogs by Sibel Edmonds 23. November 2009 It’s Time to Get the Facts Straight I want t

Justice Department Pointlessly Gags Guantánamo Lawyer

srsean1968 — Sun, 22 Nov 2009 22:46:04 +0000

Source: AndyWorthington By Andy Worthington 22.11.09 One of the saddest stories in Guantánamo is tha

CIA Black Site and Lithuanian Complicity

srsean1968 — Sun, 22 Nov 2009 22:11:58 +0000

Source: InfoWars Helena Raymond Lencevicius November 22, 2009 The latest news of yet another CIA bla

Ray McGovern: NYC 9/11 Trial Will Shine the Lights on the Roots of Terrorism

srsean1968 — Sun, 22 Nov 2009 00:42:11 +0000

Source: AlterNet By Ray McGovern November 17, 2009 As Khalid Sheikh Mohammed and the other alleged 9

CIA Secret Torture Facility Found at Horse Riding Academy

infolution — Fri, 20 Nov 2009 11:07:37 +0000

EXCLUSIVE: CIA Secret ‘Torture’ Prison Found at Fancy Horseback Riding Academy in Lithuania

ABC
November 19, 2009

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=doJ9rUQt5h8

The CIA built one of its secret European prisons inside an exclusive riding academy outside Vilnius, Lithuania, a current Lithuanian government official and a former U.S. intelligence official told ABC News this week.

Where affluent Lithuanians once rode show horses and sipped coffee at a café, the CIA installed a concrete structure where it could use harsh tactics to interrogate up to eight suspected al-Qaeda terrorists at a time.

“The activities in that prison were illegal,” said human rights researcher John Sifton. “They included various forms of torture, including sleep deprivation, forced standing, painful stress positions.”

Lithuanian officials provided ABC News with the documents of what they called a CIA front company, Elite, LLC, which purchased the property and built the “black site” in 2004.

KSM's children tortured with insects

infolution — Fri, 20 Nov 2009 10:52:31 +0000

KSM’s children tortured with insects

Raw Story
April 17, 2009

Bush Administration memos released by the White House on Thursday provide new insight into claims that American agents used insects to torture the young children of alleged 9/11 mastermind Khalid Sheikh Mohammed.

In the memos, released Thursday, the Bush Administration White House Office of Legal Counsel offered its endorsement of CIA torture methods that involved placing an insect in a cramped, confined box with detainees. Jay S. Bybee, then-director of the OLC, wrote that insects could be used to capitalize on detainees’ fears.

The memo was dated Aug. 1, 2002. Khalid Sheikh Mohammed’s children were captured and held in Pakistan the following month, according to a report by Human Rights Watch.

While an additional memo released Thursday claims that the torture with insects technique was never utilized by the CIA, the allegations regarding the children would have transpired when the method was authorized by the Bush Administration.

At a military tribunal in 2007, the father of a Guantanamo detainee alleged that Pakistani guards had confessed that American interrogators used ants to coerce the children of alleged 9/11 mastermind Khalid Shaikh Mohammed into revealing their father’s whereabouts.

The statement was made by Ali Khan, the father of detainee Majid Khan, who gave a detailed account of his son’s interrogation at the hands of American guards in Pakistan. In his statement, Khan asserted that one of his sons was held at the same place as the young children of Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, the alleged mastermind of the Sept. 11, 2001 attacks.

“The Pakistani guards told my son that the boys were kept in a separate area upstairs and were denied food and water by other guards,” the statement read. “They were also mentally tortured by having ants or other creatures put on their legs to scare them and get them to say where their father was hiding.” (A pdf transcript is available here)

Khan’s statement is second-hand. But the picture he paints of his son’s interrogation at the hands of American interrogators is strikingly similar to the accounts given by numerous other detainees to the International Red Cross. The timing of the capture of Khalid Sheikh Mohammed’s son — then aged seven and nine — also meshes with a report by Human Rights Watch, which says that the children were captured in September 2002 and held for four months at the hands of American guards.

“According to eyewitnesses, the two were held in an adult detention center for at least four months while U.S. agents questioned the children about their father’s whereabouts,” the report said.

The use of insects isn’t mentioned in a recently leaked International Red Cross report, in which Red Cross officials questioned detainees about their treatment at the hands of US forces and ultimately judged them to have been tortured. A second memo released Thursday, dated May 10, 2005, says the CIA told the White House insects were never actually used in interrogations.

“We understand that — for reasons unrelated to any concerns that it might violate the [criminal] statute — the CIA never used the technique and has removed it from the list of authorized interrogation techniques,” Steven Bradbury, a principal deputy assistant attorney general, wrote in a footnote.

It’s worth noting, however, that the Red Cross was denied access to individuals held at CIA black sites. Khan’s son, Majid, was among those President Bush moved from the CIA’s secret prison network to Guantanamo Bay.

The techniques Khan says were employed against his son also match those approved in the Bybee memo.

“What I can tell you is that Majid was kidnapped from my son Mohammed’s [not related Khalid Sheikh Mohammed] house in Karachi, along with Mohammed, his wife, and my infant granddaughter,” Khan said in his military tribunal statement. “They were captured by Pakistani police and soldiers and taken to a detention center fifteen minutes from Mohammed’s house. The center had walls that seemed to be eighty feet high. My sons were hooded, handcuffed, and interrogated. After eight days of interrogation by US and Pakistani agents, including FBI agents, Mohammed was allowed to see Majid.

“Majhid looked terrible and very, very tired,” Khan continued. “According to Mohammed, Majid said that the Americans tortured him for eight hours at a time, tying him tightly in stressful positions in a small chair until his hands, feet and mind went numb. They re-tied him in the chair every hour, tightening the bonds on his hands and feet each time so that it was more painful. He was often hooded and had difficulty breathing. They also beat him repeatedly, slapping him in the face, and deprived him of sleep. When he was not being interrogated, the Americans put Majid in a small cell that was totally dark and too small for him to lie down in or sit in with his legs stretched out. He had to crouch. The room was also infested with mosquitoes. The torture only stopped when Majid agreed to sign a statement that he was not even allowed to read.”

Later in his statement, Khan alleges that the Pakistani guards revealed other abuses by American agents.

“The Americans also once stripped and beat two Arab boys, ages fourteen and sixteen, who were turned over by the Pakistani guards at the detention center,” he said. “These guards told my son that they were very upset at this and said the boys were thrown like garbage onto a plane to Guantanamo. Women prisoners were also held there, apart from their husbands, and some were pregnant and forced to give birth in their cells. According to Mohammed, one woman also died in her cell because the guards could not get her to a hospital quickly enough. This was most upsetting to the Pakistani guards.”

One blogger notes, “The first indications the children may have been tortured were reported in Ron Suskind’s 2006 book The One Percent Doctrine.”

“When KSM was being held at a secret CIA facility in Thailand, apparently the revamped Vietnam War-era base at Udorn, according to Suskind, a message was passed to interrogators: ‘do whatever’s necessary,’” Kevin Fenton writes at History Commons. “The interrogators then told KSM ‘his children would be hurt if he didn’t cooperate. However, his response was, ’so, fine, they’ll join Allah in a better place.’”

Fenton has two questions: “Did the Khans invent the allegations or garble them in some way and then ‘get lucky’ two years later, when it was revealed the CIA was, at least, contemplating the techniques they alleged it used at the time in question?” and “Given that nobody heard of the CIA using insects for another two years, why would they invent these specific allegations, which sounded bizarre when they were made?”

Abu Ghraib Prisoners Submerged in Ice-Water

New Gitmo Video: Child Detainee Cries During Interrogation

Tortured Patsies To Take Fall For 9/11

Child Prisoners in Iraq Suffering Same Abuse as Adults

UK Judge Approves Use of Secret Evidence in Guantánamo Case by Andy Worthington

dandelionsalad — Fri, 20 Nov 2009 04:15:24 +0000

by Andy Worthington Featured Writer Dandelion Salad www.andyworthington.co.uk 19 November 2009 Those

Report: C.I.A. Secret 'Torture Prison' Found in Lithuania

Editors — Fri, 20 Nov 2009 00:15:42 +0000

Brian Ross and Matthew Cole broke the story last night on the ABC News website. Their report on “Good Morning America” from Thursday morning (2:51):

Until March 2004, “the site was a riding academy and café owned by a local family” in Antavillai, Lithuania. Then, it was purchased by Elite L.L.C., a front corporation of the Central intelligence Agency, and used as a “secret ‘torture center’” in the Bush Administration’s “extraordinary rendition” kidnapping and torture program, Brian Ross and Matthew Cole report at ABC News from documents provided by Lithuanian officials and confirmed by one current official and a former U.S. intelligence official.

John Sifton, human rights lawyer and executive director of One World Research, investigates human rights abuses worldwide. He recently told Anastasia Churkina at Russia Today that C.I.A. agents kept detainees alive just to keep torturing them and found the C.I.A. “set up extensive detention programs around the world” that started in Thailand and expanded to Afghanistan, Jordan, Poland, Romania and another unknown. The third European site, he was told, bordered Poland and many C.I.A. flights went in and out of Lithuania.

After then-President George W. Bush pledged support for Lithuanian efforts to join the NATO alliance in 2002, Mr. Ross and Mr. Cole report, the government “agreed to allow the C.I.A. prison”. Coincidentally, Lithuania formally joined NATO in March 2004.

ABC News first reported that Lithuania was one of three eastern European countries, along with Poland and Romania, where the CIA secretly interrogated suspected high-value al-Qaeda terrorists, but until now the precise site had not been confirmed….

Former CIA officials directly involved or briefed on the highly classified secret prison program tell ABC News that as many as eight suspects were held for more than a year in the Vilnius prison. Flight logs viewed by ABC News confirm that CIA planes made repeated flights into Lithuania during that period. In November 2005, after public disclosures about the program, the prison was closed, as was another “black site” in Romania….

Former CIA officials told ABC News that the prison in Lithuania was one of eight facilities the CIA set-up after 9/11 to detain and interrogate top al-Qaeda operatives captured around the world. Thailand, Romania, Poland, Morocco, and Afghanistan have also been identified as countries that housed secret prisons for the CIA. President Barack Obama ordered all the sites closed shortly after taking office in January.

The Lithuanian prison was the last “black” site opened in Europe, after the CIA’s secret prison in Poland was closed down in late 2003 or early 2004.

“It obviously took a lot of effort to keep [the prison] secret,” said John Sifton, whose firm One World Research investigates human rights abuses. “There’s a reason this stuff gets kept secret.”

“It’s an embarrassment, and a crime.”

Though, the C.I.A. detention program was smaller than that of the military, Mr. Sifton found it was “the one that saw the biggest abuses and most serious forms of torture” and was exponentially clandestine. The Agency’s secret prisons are commonly known as “black sites” which served as a “model” for the military’s.

He added that the Obama Administration has prevented the C.I.A. from detaining people and using “black sites”, but are still permitted to interrogate detainees.

“Domas Grigaliunas, a former counterintelligence officer with the Lithuanian military, said it was widely known among the Lithuanian secret services that U.S. intelligence partners had built the site, although its original purpose was kept highly classified,” Craig Whitlock reports at The Washington Post, adding:

Grigaliunas said he was asked in 2004 by the deputy director of Lithuanian military intelligence to develop plans to help a “foreign partner” that was interested in bringing individuals to Lithuania and concealing their whereabouts as part of a covert operation.…

Villagers who live in a crumbling apartment complex about 100 yards from the site recalled how English-speaking construction workers descended on a small, shuttered horse-riding academy there in 2004. They said the workers refused to answer questions about what they were doing but brought shipping containers filled with building materials. The workers also excavated large amounts of soil; with all the digging, residents said they assumed that part of the new facility was underground.

“If you got close, they would tell us, in English, to go away,” said a retired man who lives nearby and spoke on the condition of anonymity, citing fears of retribution. “We were really wondering what they were up to. We even wondered if it was a Mafia drug operation or something.“

Lithuanian officials, including President Dalia Grybauskaite, denied the initial report from ABC News with the Polish and Romanian governments. She would not comment to them on the most recent report, though she said she harbored “indirect suspicions” and was not in power while the “black site” was reportedly sold to the Lithuanian State in 2007. “‘There are more important things in Lithuania than spending two days denying the gossip of ABC journalists,’ Foreign Minister Vygaudas Usackas told the Baltic News Service,” David Edwards reports at The Raw Story.

The extremely redacted C.I.A. Inspector General report found detainees faced mock executions, threats to kill and rape family members, waterboarding, extensive pressure point restriction, forced stress positions, sleep and light deprivation in custody. Not redacted was a case where a detainee was beaten to death by a private contractor.

The Logic of the 9/11 Trials, The Madness of the Military Commissions by Andy Worthington

dandelionsalad — Wed, 18 Nov 2009 23:48:57 +0000

by Andy Worthington Featured Writer Dandelion Salad www.andyworthington.co.uk 18 November 2009 With

Bill O'Reilly: "I Don't Care About The Constitution"

infolution — Wed, 18 Nov 2009 15:37:38 +0000

Bill O’Reilly: “I Don’t Care About The Constitution”

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5eBrfql3pnU

O’Reilly: “We Can’t Kill All the Muslims”

CIA agents reveal money flows to Pakistani ISI in Reward for Justice programme, say up 700 suspects were handed over

Mathias Vermeulen — Tue, 17 Nov 2009 11:48:05 +0000

The CIA has funneled hundreds of millions of dollars to Pakistan’s intelligence service since

UK official criticizes High Court for ordering release of torture evidence

Mathias Vermeulen — Sun, 15 Nov 2009 11:29:00 +0000

UK Foreign and Commonwealth Office (FCO) Director of Defense and Strategic Threats, Simon Manley, cr

An Evening with Andy Worthington: "Outside the Law: Stories from Guantanamo"

dandelionsalad — Sat, 14 Nov 2009 22:54:18 +0000

by Andy Worthington Featured Writer Dandelion Salad www.andyworthington.co.uk 14 November 2009 As pa

Ray McGovern: Why Accountability for Torture Is Crucial for Human Rights

dandelionsalad — Sat, 14 Nov 2009 07:59:24 +0000

Dandelion Salad talkingsticktv November 13, 2009 Talk by 27-year Veteran of the CIA Ray McGovern on

Extraordinary Rendition, The Story of Abu Omar, Ctd.

Filip Spagnoli — Thu, 12 Nov 2009 08:08:18 +0000

This post is by guest writer Robert Nijssen who also has his own blog.

Abu Omar is an imam from Egyptian origin, who was kidnapped by the CIA from the streets of Milan. For more information on his kidnapping please refer to my original post here. Last week the Italian trial against the involved CIA operatives was concluded and most of the operatives received substantial jail sentences. Please refer here for the whole story, or here for an interesting counter opinion.