***EDITOR: Well I am a little late with this week old news but thought I would share this…. Oral Roberts was a false prophet and teacher – responsible in part for mentoring other wolves such as beast prophets Kenneth Copeland and Creflo Dollar. For years I followed this guy until Father YHWH opened my eyes to the falseness of his ministry in 2008. Oral was an exposed Freemason and preacher of the Law-less proserity gospel and I sure hope he repented to YHWH for his greed and lies before he died… or we will not see him til the judgement when he is cast into the Lake of Fire. Well Oral it wasnt worth it …. eternity is a long time***

Source: Associated Press ( Dec 21-2009)

For decades, Oral Roberts deftly used television to become one of the nation’s most recognized and influential preachers. On Monday, that same medium was used to broadcast the memorial service for the godfather of TV evangelism to tens of millions of homes across the world.

At Roberts’ namesake university in south Tulsa, about 4,000 people — some who waited hours in their cars for the doors to open — packed a campus arena to pay final tribute to the charismatic leader who rose from poverty and humble tent revivals to build a multimillion-dollar ministry so enormous that it had its own ZIP code.

Roberts died last week of complications from pneumonia in Newport Beach, Calif. He was 91.

“You sent us a man who we know and loved, and who walked with God and never gave up the common touch,” fellow TV evangelist Pat Robertson said during the ceremony’s opening prayer. “I know you broke the mold with Oral.”

The event was part spectacle, carried live by the Inspiration Network and its international counterpart, which can reach about 140 million homes.

The guest list was a Who’s Who of TV evangelists — most of whom tie their success to Roberts — and some arrived in the six stretch limousines, two Jaguars, Cadillacs and a Mercedes Benz parked curbside.

READ REST HERE

ARTICLES EXPOSING ORAL ROBERTS AS A FREEMASON:

• Famous Freemasons
• Copeland and Roberts: 33rd degree masons EXPOSED!
• Roberts a part of Southern Brotherhood Masons
• Reason to believe Oral Roberts is a Freemason

I’ve pretty much sworn off of “Christian” television. The various networks seemed to be filled with individuals and couples alike, bent on flaunting varying forms of selfishness, self-exaltation, and idolatry. The little doctrinally sound or orthodox ministry that is televised is far outweighed by the fluff and heresy that appears. Where is the widespread outrage from ministers and ministries that believe that orthodoxy has died a slow death on television and in local church ministry? Where are the servants?

I’m in the process of writing my doctoral dissertation that seeks to address the dearth of servants, and in particular servant leaders, in the local church. My passion for this topic stems from the steady decline of servants in ministry leadership that I have watched occur over nearly twenty years in local church ministry leadership. We, the Church, have reached the point where the drought of servants in ministry leadership must decline or the fulfillment of our mission is in extreme jeopardy. Let me explain that last statement a bit more…God’s use of us in the fulfillment of his mission is in extreme jeopardy. I have no doubt that God’s will be done and his mission in the earth fulfilled, with or without us.

I just needed to rant for a moment about what I’m seeing in the local church and in the Church worldwide. Where are the servants? Where are those who serve because it needs to be done, not so that they can make a name for themselves? Where are those who served regardless of who sees, without a banner or camera present? I know that there are some out there, my fear is that there are far too few? What do you think?

FROM: How2BecomeAChristianBLOG.com

Rebuttal of Kenneth Copeland on Tithing

BY Russell Earl Kelly, PHD

August 18, 2009

Understanding Tithing, Kenneth Copeland

http://www.kcm.org/real-help/article…anding-tithing

Russell Kelly: When it comes to discussing any doctrine with Word of Faith preachers such as Kenneth Copeland, it is impossible to dialog from the standpoint of biblical hermeneutics (principles of interpretation). Word of Faith ignores context and uses God’s Word as a magic Ouija board to pull meaning out of individual words against God’s teaching.

Copeland: “Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be meat in mine house, and prove me now herewith, saith the Lord of hosts, if I will not open you the windows of heaven, and pour you out a blessing, that there shall not be room enough to receive it. And I will rebuke the devourer for your sakes, and he shall not destroy the fruits of your ground; neither shall your vine cast her fruit before the time in the field, saith the Lord of hosts” (Malachi 3:10-11).

Kelly: This is the most mis-interpreted text in all of the Bible. God does not and cannot bless New Covenant believers because of their supposed obedience to one of hundreds of Old Covenant commands which were never commanded to the Church after Calvary (1:1, 6; 2:1).
Copeland: This is God Himself speaking and He is saying, “Prove Me in this.” This is the only time in the Word where God instructs us to prove Him, and it is the one area where most people have withdrawn from proving God.

Kelly: First, Malachi was addressed only to Old Covenant national Israel and NOT to New Covenant Christians. Second, the statement by Copeland is false. The whole law was a test –not merely tithing. Obey ALL to be blessed; break ONE to be cursed. The only way to claim blessings from tithing would be to obey the whole Old Covenant law (Neh 10:29; Gal 3:110-13). And, even then, God is working through His New Covenant stipulations. See http://www.tithing-russkelly.com/id154.html.
Copeland: Tithing was instituted under the Old Covenant as a way for God to communicate His blessing to His people.
Kelly: Notice that Copeland does not even give “out of context” texts to validate this statement. He merely declares it to be so! That is his specialty. Tithing was instituted in Numbers 18 to sustain Levites and priests for ministering in the sanctuary and for losing land and property inheritance. Copeland gets both: he received the tithe and he owns much property which is against the tithing law.
Copeland: The word tithe means “tenth or ten percent.”

Kelly: This is the greatest lie of tithe-teachers. If one defines “tithe” from God’s Word it always refers only to food from inside Israel which had been miraculously increased by God. Although money was common even in Genesis and essential for sanctaury worship, money was never included in the 16 texts which describe the contents of the tithe. Jesus, Peter and Paul did not qualify as tithe-payers and neither did the poor nor those (like almost all of us) who lived outside of Israel in defiled pagan lands.

Copeland: Proverbs 3:9 says, “Honour the Lord with thy substance, and with the firstfruits of all thine increase.” Tithes are to be given from the first fruits, from the top— the gross, not the net.

Kelly: This is another common lie told by tithe-teachers. Firstfruits and tithes were never the same thing in the Bible. Firstfruits were very small token offerings per Deu 26:1-4; Neh 10:35-38 and the Pentecost wave-sheaf. Tithes were tenth-fruit only after the full harvest or every tenth animal –whether the best or not per Lev 27:30-34.

Copeland: A person who does not tithe is robbing God and is operating under a curse (Malachi 3:8-9). The first fruits of our income is God’s; it is not ours to use to pay bills.

Kelly: Copeland has combined two lies here. If he receives tithes, then he should obey the whole tithing satute of Numbers 18. (1) Give the first whole Levitical tithe to Levite servants such as ushers, deacons, choir, musicians and politicians per 18:21-24 and 1 Chron 23 to 26. (2) Only give 1% to priests per 18:25-28. (3) Ignore the NT doctrine of the priesthood of every believer. (4) Only allow preachers inside the sanctuary. (5) Forfeit property ownrship and (6) kill anybody who dares to worship God directly. See Numbers 18.

Copeland: Tithing is different from seed-faith gifts and offerings. The tithe is your 10 percent that God commands us to give—gifts and offerings are above and beyond it.

Kelly: Tithes were always only food from food producers inside Israel. Everybody else could only give freewill offerings. The NT church always only gave freewill offerings.

Copeland: Some people want to give “as the Lord leads them” instead of tithing—but the Spirit would never lead you against His Word. The Word says to tithe.

Kelly: Notice tha Copeland has no biblical validation for the church because the church was never commadned by the Spirit to tithe.

Copeland: Tithing is not only an Old Covenant command, but also a New Testament blessing and privilege. Hebrews 7:8 says, “Here men that die receive tithes. But there he receiveth them, of whom it is witnessed that he liveth.”

Kelly: Copeland ignores the context of Hebrews 7:5, 12, 18, 19. In 7:12 we are told that it was “necessary to change the law” of tithing first mentioned in 7:5. And 7:18 says that the “commandment going before” to tithe from 7:5 had been “annulled” because of its “weakness” and “unprofitableness”and because of the better new covenant of 7:19.

Copeland: In the Old Covenant, God’s people would place their tithe—the first fruits of their increase—in a basket, present it to the high priest, and say to him, “I profess this day unto the Lord thy God, that I am come unto the country which the Lord sware unto our fathers for to give us” (Deuteronomy 26:2-3). They spoke their redemption.

Kelly: Manipulation! Read Deuteronomy 26:1-4. It is speaking of the firstfrutis and not the tithe. And the “firstfruits” are so very small that they would fit into a small handbasket.

Copeland: According to Colossians 1:13, we have been delivered from the power of darkness and translated into the kingdom of his dear Son. As believers, we are living in the kingdom of God. We have entered into our inheritance in Jesus Christ and possess it in His Name. Jesus is the High Priest of the New Covenant.

Kelly: Copeland is mixing context to emphasize his false conclusion.

Copeland: When we take our tithes to our High Priest and speak our redemption, He receives them and then presents them to the Father (Hebrews 3:1, 7:8).

Kelly: This is classic Word of Faith out-of-context manipulation. There is no connection between Hebrews 3:1 and 7:8. Copeland says that our tithes must be with us when we approach God –sounds like a bribe. Are the poor to tithe and do without medication and essential food and shelter? Copeland thinks so.

Copeland: When we stand on our covenant with God and exercise our rights as tithers, we lay a foundation for success and abundance. Satan has no chance against us.

Kelly: We stand on the New Covenant which was sealed at Calvary and given to the Church after Calvary. It does not contain a single word commanding the church to tithe. NT giving is freewill, generous, sacrificial, joyful, not by commandment or percentage and motivated by love for God and lost souls. For many that means more than 10% and for many others means less than 10%. Satan has no chance with us even if we cannot afford to give 10%.

Copeland: Tithing the tithe rebukes the devourer!

Kelly: The context is that of food from Israel and the definition of food never changed for over 1500 years from Leviticus to Luke. Why?

Copeland: When we resist Satan in the Name of Jesus, God’s rebuke is in action.

Kelly: This is true whether or not one can afford to give 10%. The poor widow had nothing to give after giving her last cent.

Copeland: God told the Israelites their words were stout against Him. They were confessing lack and want. It is important to speak our redemption in order for the tithe to produce.

Kelly: This is Word of Faith gibberish which ignores the context.

Copeland: Where you place you tithe depends on where you are receiving your spiritual food. God says to bring the tithes into the storehouse. That is where the food is—where a pastor, an evangelist, an apostle or some other ministry is in operation.

Kelly: Read Nehemiah 10:37b-38. The ordinary people were commanded to bring their tithes to the 48 (later 13) Levitical cities where the Levites and priests received them together per Numbers 35 and Joshua 20 and 21. Also read Nehemiah 13:5. The Temple only had two small storerooms to hold the tithe for those rotating a week at a time in service. Malachi 3:10 makes no sense unless it only refers to the dishonest priests of 1:13-14. The ekklesia-church is not a storehouse and no buildings existed for over 200 years after Calvary.

Copeland: When you give, you are not giving to an individual, but for the furtherance of the gospel. Since your tithe is God’s money and since Jesus is the One who handles and receives it, you should always pray and let Him tell you where it should be put to work.

Kelly: Copeland, Hinn, the Crouches and all of the Word of Faith preachers will gladly receive your sacrifice and use it to buy airplanes and many properties in violation of Numbers 18.

Russell Earl Kelly, PHD

http://www.tithing-russkelly.com/id173.html

If you notice, at the end of the title there is a period–not a question mark. It is not great secret that the prosperity “gospel” is heresy. But, how do we explain just how many levels of heresy are involved in the TBN crowd’s twisting and perverting of God’s word for their own financial gain? Well, I made these videos for just that purpose. To tear the prosperity “gospel” apart, and show, piece by piece, why this is such a perversion and blasphemy. I apologize for the little places where the audio is kinda choppy. I guess I should have “sown” into a video production ministry, eh?

NOTE: In the 4th video, there is a 5-second still from “The Passion of the Christ.” It is not meant to be an endorsement of the film by any means (and I do not recommend it whatsoever). However, I wanted a picture of Christ on the cross, and, unfortunately, this was the only one that doesn’t portray Him with, as one fellow said, “pretty blue eyes and curly brown hair and a clear complexion.”

Going home?

Reader comments (105)

Nearly 4,000 people gathered at the Oral Roberts University Mabee Center on Monday afternoon to say goodbye to the major figure of Darby/Scofield New Christianity. In addition to preaching the rapture hoax doctrine, Roberts was the god-father of prosperity religion (Kabbalah). Roberts left his legacy and millions are now following the same false teachings.

America’s televangelists have had more than their fair share of scandals involving sex, fraud and extremist politics. But Oral Roberts, who has died aged 91 of complications from pneumonia, always devoted himself to money – and occasionally, God. He even justified his love of wealth with a biblical source.
href=”http://www.huffingtonpost.com/randall-balmer/oral-roberts-death-leaves_b_394447.html”>Oral Roberts’ Death Leaves Legacy Of Televangelism

America’s televangelists have had more than their fair share of scandals involving sex, fraud and extremist politics. But Oral Roberts, who has died aged 91 of complications from pneumonia, always devoted himself to money – and occasionally, God. He even justified his love of wealth with a biblical source.

Televangelists Oral Roberts have had more than his fair share of scandals involving sex, fraud and extremist politics. But Oral Roberts, who has died aged 91 of complications from pneumonia, always devoted himself to money – and occasionally, God. He even justified his love of wealth with a biblical source.

LOS ANGELES (Reuters) – Oral Roberts, who became one of America’s most successful and controversial TV preacher with claims of faith healing and unusual money-raising tactics, died on Tuesday at the age of 91.

Oral Roberts Ministries published a tribute to Roberts on its website and news reports said that he died in Newport Beach, California, of complications from pneumonia.

Roberts, a preacher’s son, started out putting on charismatic revival meetings in tents. He later took his ministry to radio and then to television, a path taken by other fiery evangelists such as Pat Robertsonand Billy Graham.

He based his organization in Tulsa, Oklahoma, centered around Oral Roberts University, which he said he founded in 1963 with on a command from the Masonic God.

Hailing from Oklahoma, Roberts had Native American roots through his mother’s side of the family, a heritage he took pride in. In 1986, Roberts announced that God would “call him home” unless he raised $8 million to send medical missionaries from the center — an announcement that was widely publicized. He wound up raising $9.1 million, but the center closed in 1989. However, the biography said, it left “a lasting impact on the understanding by many medical professionals of the importance of treating the whole person — body, mind and spirit.”

TRUTH ABOUT THE RAPTURE

The rapture theory is not Biblical and was founded as an Anti-Reformation tool of the Catholic Church. The word rapture comes from the Latin word rapio meaning – seize by force, kidnap, pillage, rob, and rape. Jerome mistranslated harpazo (caught -up) when he translated the Septuagint (Greek Bible) into Latin. The purpose of the rapture theory was threeflod. 1. To destroy the reformation; 2. control protestantism;, capture the Holy Land; 3. Foster the

establishment of the New Word Order . The rapture theory has more to do with the racist, arrogant and diabolical concept of British Israel than anything pertaining to the Kingdom of God. The rapture theory is from the pits of hell, created by Luciferians, and promoted by agents of the prince of darkness. The rapture doctrine is the blue-print for the establishment of the pseudo state of Israel.

Barbara Rossing said in her book The Rapture Racket,

” the Rapture is a fraud of monumental proportions, as well as a disturbing way to instill fear in people.

“Whether prescribing a violent script for Israel or survivalism in the United States, this theology distorts God’s vision for the world,” Rossing writes. “In place of healing, the Rapture proclaims escape. In place of Jesus’s blessing of peacemaking, the Rapture voyeuristically glorifies violence and war …. This theology is not biblical. We are not Raptured off the earth, nor is God.

Where did the rapture theory originate and why?

Reformers such as Luther, Calvin, Huss, Zwingli, Melanchthon, Bullinger and others had identified the Catholic Church as Mystery Babylon in Revelation and the Popes as the Anti-Christ. Millions of sincere Catholics were leaving the mother church and joining the reformation movement.. The church set out to neutralize and destroy the protestant movement.. What they could not do through

brute force and the military inquisitions they did through political espionage, spiritual intrigue, and using mind control techniques by secret societies. Most of the books published on the rapture are brainwashing the readers mind. All of the books writen by Tim Lahaye’s, John Hagee, Jack van Impe, Jerry Jenkins , John Walvoord and movies such as the Omega Code and Megiddo are design for mind control. This anti-protestant doctrine is taught in many universities and seminaries such as Dallas Theological Seminary, Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary, Southwestern Assemblies of God, Zion Bible College, Moody Bible Institute, Global University, Liberty and Regent University and well as a host of other leading colleges and universities The rapture cult has the largest following than any cult in the US or Europe.

Why were sincere Catholics, priests and monks leaving the Catholic Church.?

People were leaving because of corruptions in the church. If one look at the Babylonian sun worship, and the present Roman Catholic Mass there are many similarities. Baal worship seem to have taken over the Catholic Church. The icon of the virgin mother and child with halos (representing the sun), Mary as the queen of heaven,

(Isis – queen of heaven) confessionals, wafer worship, transubstantiation, and priests as exclusive mediators of God were all derived from the Satanic Babylonian religion. Roman Catholicism became a mixture of witchcraft, Judaism, paganism, and perverted Christianity. When this corruptions was exposed by the reformers, Rome was outraged, and staged Holy Inquisitions, design to rid the world of heretics. The Inquisition included torturing and murdering people who didn’t not agree with the Catholic views. Ten of thousands of people were killed and some historians even put the numbers in the millions. Later, in response to the Vatican’s oppressive dogma, Martin Luther, a former Augustinian monk, nailed his 95 theses to the wall of a church in Germany, heralding Protestantism. . The Vatican was shaken as Protestantism spreads rapidly through Europe. In order to stamp out the spiritual rebellion, Pope Paul III ordered Ignatius de Loyola to found the Order of Jesuits, which would act as the intelligentsia and secret militia of the Vatican. Loyola had already founded the occult Illuminati, which he then placed under the umbrella of the Vatican ” Ignatius a Merovingian Jew from Loyola Spain was a member of the Alumbrados before he founded the Illuminati and the Jesuits.

The Merovingian Jews claim to be decedents of Jesus and Mary of Magdalene. Thus you have books and movies like DaVinci Code, Prieure de Sion, Passover Plot, Holy Blood Holy Grail, Bloodline of the Holy Grail, being produced and circulated by Hollywood Kabbalist movie studios and publishing houses controlled by the Illuminati. These books are blasphemous teachings design to nullify the true Gospel of Jesus. Many of the Popes, Cardinals, Bishops and Priest were Merovingian Jews whose agenda was to destroy true Christianity and pervert the true gospel.

The Jesuits Oath:

“I furthermore promise and declare that I will, when opportunity present, make and wage relentless war, secretly or openly, against all heretics, Protestants and Liberals, as I am directed to do, to extirpate and exterminate them from the face of the whole earth; and that I will spare neither age, sex or condition; and that I will hang, waste, boil, flay, strangle and bury alive these infamous heretics, rip up the stomachs and wombs of their women and crush their infants’ heads against the walls, in order to annihilate forever their execrable race. That when the same cannot be done openly, I will secretly use the poisoned cup, the strangulating cord, the steel of the poniard or the leaden bullet, regardless of the honor, rank, dignity, or authority of the person or persons, whatever may be their condition in life, either public or private, as I at any time may be directed so to do by any agent of the Pope or Superior of the Brotherhood of the Holy Faith, of the Society of Jesus.

It was when Pope Paul III convened the Council of Trent that the church formally addressed the protestant reformation with edicts, dogmas and doctrines. A disciple of Ignatius, Francisco Ribera came up with a theory that would take the attention off the Pope as being the Anti-Christ and put it on some future individual. This was the beginning of the Rapture doctrine. The Jesuits infiltrated the protestant movement, developed protestant theology, and purposely mis interpreted scriptures relating to Bible prophecy. They also controlled the educational system and bribe and blackmailed governments of Europe and America to promote their agenda. Two other groups that were instrumental the origin and development of the rapture theory were the Knights Templars (Masons) and the Knights of Malta (Knights of Columbus).

Barbara Aho said in her article (The Merovingian Dynasty) “it was also the The avowed objective of the Templars was to protect the Christians who came to visit the Holy Places: their secret objective was the re-building of the Temple of Solomon on the model prophesied by Ezekiel.
“This re-building, formally predicted by the Judaizing Mystics of the earlier ages, had become the secret dream of the Patriarchs of the Orient. The Temple of Solomon, re-built and consecrated to the Catholic worship would become, in effect, the Metropolis of the Universe.”
In my up coming blog I will go into more detail about how the Jesuits and the Illuminati set about to implement the Rapture theory to achieve their goal.. Protestant churches, Evangelical seminaries, and bible talking and Bibleprobe preachers like John Hagee, Jack van Impe, Jack Hayford, TD Jakes, Kenneth Hagin, Kenneth Copeland, Pat Robinson, Creflo Dollar, Bishop Charles Blake, Billy Graham, and masons who promote the rapture have been seduced by Jesuits theology and manipulated by the kabbalist practitioners, thus they are part of the world-wide Anti-Christ conspiracy.

Is Modern-Day Israel in Bible Prophecy?

Millions expect Israel to play a major role in God’s future plan for earth. Could they all be wrong? Is there a conspiracy to deceive God’s people? What is the Biblical evidence concerning modern day Israel?

Many people today consider the restoration of the Jewish nation in Palestine to be a direct and dramatic fulfillment of Bible prophecy.

Hal Lindsey’s The Late Great Planet Earth, a phenomenal best seller of the last few decades, and Jerry Jenkins and Tim Lahaye’s Lift Behind, along with Bishop T.D. Jakes declares that the end of the world will come within the lifetime of the generation that saw the founding of the Israeli state in 1948, hereby applying the words of Jesus: “This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.” (Matthew 24:34)

Coupled with this fascination with Israel is a novel teaching regarding the return of Jesus, called the “secret rapture.” These books and many other speaks for many today who expect God secretly to take the “church” to heaven prior to the rebuilding of the Jewish Temple on its old site where the sacred Muslim shrine, the Dome of the Rock, now stands. According to this position, after the “church” is “raptured” to heaven, there will be seven years of the worst period of famine, bloodshed, and pestilence ever experienced by man. During this great tribulation the focus will be on God’s dealings with the Jews, who are again given the responsibility for the evangelization of the world.

According to secret-rapture preachers, the battle of Armageddon will climax the end of the seven-year tribulation as the nations of the earth take sides over the future of Israel. When mankind teeters on the brink of incinerating the world, Jesus will return gloriously and save man from self-extinction. At that time Jesus will set up a literal one-thousand-year reign on earth with Jerusalem functioning as the spiritual capital of the world.

Most evangelical periodicals and pulpits teach this view today, and to those who do not know better, it might appear that this prophetic scenario, known as pretribulationism, has been the traditional teaching of the Christian church since New Testament days. Nothing is further from the truth. Be not deceived.. Did the architects of the creation of modern day Israel have any thing to do with the development of the rapture theory? Where did the Rapture theology originate? Is the crisis in the Middle East and the war in the Iraq have anything to do with the erroneous rapture theory?

Is there a master conspiracy at work

According to dispensationalists John Hagee, Jack van Impe, Ken Copeland, Kenneth Hagin, John Walvoord, Grant Jefferies, Tim Lahaye, Benny Hinn, Clarence Larkin, H. Caldwell, TD Jakes and others who teach and preach about the Rapture, Israel has two dispensations, or time periods, in which they functions as God’s special instrument of salvation. Between these two periods of time comes the dispensation of the “church”. The church received a heavenly reward at the time of the rapture, while Israel received an earthly reward at the end of the tribulation.

There is no support in the New Testament for such an erroneous view.
The chief reason why the modern state of Israel has no prophetic significance is that after the Jews as a body rejected Jesus as the Messiah, God gave to the Christian church the special privileges, responsibilities, and prerogatives once assigned to the ancient Jews. No longer were the Jews to be His special people with a prophetic destiny.
Rom.2:28 For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly, nor is circumcision that which is outward in the flesh; vs.29 but he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the Spirit, not in the letter; whose praise is not from men but from God.
All the promises of a glorious kingdom on earth once given through the Jewish prophets to the Jewish people became void because the Jewish people as a nation did not fulfill the conditions of these prophecies. Failing to receive the glory that could have been Israel’s is probably the saddest story in literature. Placed at the crossroads of the ancient world, God furnished them with every facility for becoming the greatest nation on the earth. God wanted to reward Israel with every physical and spiritual blessing as they put into practice the clear-cut principles that He had graciously taught them through His prophets (Deuteronomy 7, 8, 28).
The Old Testament records the sad story of how the vineyard of Israel produced, not the mature fruit of a Christ-like character, but “wild grapes,” a misinterpretation and perversion of what the God of Israel was really like. “What more was there to do for my vineyard, that I have not done in it? When I looked for it to yield grapes, why did it yield wild grapes?” (Isaiah 5:4 RSV).

Even when the Jewish nation was suffering the bitter consequences of disobedience during the Babylonian captivity, God mercifully promised that a restored Israel was possible and that there was yet time to recover its special role as His representative on earth – if it would honor His law and submit to His principles. Even then the Jews could have become, if faithful, the head and not the tail, in matters physical and spiritual; all nations would have looked upon Jerusalem as not only the center of wisdom but also the spiritual capital of the world (see Isaiah 45:14; 60:1 – 11).
When the Jews returned to Palestine after the Babylonian captivity, the promises given to Abraham and expanded through the writings of Moses and other prophets would have been fulfilled; the whole earth would have been alerted for the first advent of Christ, even as the way is being prepared for His second coming today.
Missed Their Last Opportunity.
These Old Testament prophecies that picture Israel dwelling in peace and prosperity, with all nations beating a path to her doors, could have been fulfilled 2000 years ago if they had indeed prepared the world for the first coming of Jesus (see Zechariah 8:14). But instead of fulfilling their greatest assignment they missed their last opportunity, and Jesus their Lord finally had to pronounce with irrevocable judgement: “O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, killing the prophets and stoning those who are sent to you! How often would I have gathered your children together as a hen gathers her brood under her wings, and you would not Behold your house is forsaken and desolate” (Matthew 23:37, 38 RSV).
Those who regard the establishment of the modern state of Israel as a fulfillment of those Old Testament prophecies overlook the fact that these promises were made either prior to their release from Babylonian captivity or during the rebuilding days soon after their return. God would have fulfilled these promises if Israel had been faithful and obedient to the conditions on which the promises were made.
Although God promised a “second chance” to Israel after their failure leading up to the Babylonian captivity, He promised no “third chance” to them after their final rejection when their Lord Himself “came to his own home, and his own people received him not” (John 1:11 RSV)
But God did not give up, even though Israel as a nation had failed Him. Although corporate Israel no longer was to function as God’s special agent, the individual Jews who received and obeyed Jesus Christ would constitute the new organization through which He would now work.
Paul describes this remarkable transition in Romans 9 to 11, where he appeals to individual Jews (such as himself) to respond to God through Jesus, join those Gentiles who have found in Him the solution to their anxious, sinful condition, and together arouse the world to the simple fact that God wants to make an end to sin and its misery by setting up His eternal kingdom composed of those who have found in Jesus the promised Saviour.
Those who preach and teach this erroneous Rapture doctrine are purposely misleading multitudes. This doctrine was created by the Jesuits as an anti-reformation and anti-protestant tool to divert attention away from the Catholic and the Pope whom the reformers had identify as the anti-Christ in Revelation. Those who teach and preach the rapture theory are proxies and agents for the Kabbalists and those who want to establish a New World Order (NWO). The Rapture theory has more to do with politics than theology, more to do with mans involvement in world affairs than Gods involvement, more about Zionism than the people of Zion. I will discuss this later.

British Israel, The Hidden Hand Behind The ‘Kingdom of God on …

The Cost of Christian-Zionism – Is it of God?

The Impact of Christian Zionism on American Policy and World Policy

Torch of Truth International: The New World Order – Religious and Political Conspiracy…

Celebrity sightings
Wed, Dec 16 2009

Pictures of the year: Science

Bernanke: Person of the yearTime

Parenting from prison

Pictures of the Decade Part 9

Exonerated man ‘not angry’ after decades in prison

Trinity Broadcasting Network (TBN) is an easy target.  I once heard it referred to as the “wood, hay, and straw network” (cf. 1 Cor. 3:12).

John MacArthur knows this all too well:

Recently, however, while recovering from knee-replacement surgery, I decided to sample some of the current fare on TBN. From a therapeutic point of view it seemed a good choice: something more excruciating than the pain in my leg might distract me from the physical suffering of post-surgical trauma.  And I suppose on that basis the strategy was effective.

But it left me outraged and frustrated—and eager to challenge the misperceptions in the minds of millions of unbelievers who see these false teachers masquerading as ministers of Christ on TBN.  Read entire article…

• HT: Jeff

John MacArthur’s mind was already decidedly against TBN:  ”From a therapeutic point of view it seemed a good choice: something more excruciating than the pain in my leg might distract me from the physical suffering of post-surgical trauma.”

And neither should we should presume upon God: “How unsearchable His judgments and untraceable His ways!” (Romans 11:33b, HCSB).

God still uses TBN…

The City of Houston, Texas has become the first major US city with an openly-gay Mayor. Recently, Annise Parker, was elected as the Gayor of Houston beating out some black guy.

Apparently, Houston is now America’s Gayest City. That’s quite an accomplishment! We spoke to some of the Gayor’s supporters and here is what they had to say:

“We’re filled with PRIDE,” said Bobbie Joe Burley. “This city is so racist that they’d rather put one of us in office that an African-American.”

“We have an openly-black President and now this,” boasted Ted Brown, a man-lover for 39 years. “It’s very arousing!”

“My life partner and I are so excited to have one of our kind in office,” stated Jody “The Fist” Fisher. “We’re hoping to cover this city with the kind of love that only we can give.”

Other residents, however, did not share in the joys of the homosexuals.

“What’s next? Women doctors?,” inquired Bubba Longfellow. “There wasn’t much to choose from in this race. I’m moving as soon as possible.”

“(Screw) these (people who engage in filthy sexual acts with members of the same sex)”, said a man who only wanted to be identified as “Josef”. “I can’t believe what this (freaking) city has (freaking) become.”

“If I see another rainbow,” added “John”. “I’m gonna git my gun.”

Rainbow wigs, rainbow flags, rainbow sno cones, rainbow everything. Houston is the city where it’s okay to find love in any moist hole you desire. This is a landmark win for those who enjoy the taste of of their own genitals.

Annise Parker, gay

Apparently, it is!

Houstonians saw this as “less evil” than the Black Agenda

Ms. Clinton is “overjoyed”

Official Sponsor of the 2009 Houston Mayoral Debate

Can you possibly mix face to face networking along with online networking?  Yes, you can.  Tri-State Business Network group is successfully doing it.  If you visit one of our meetings, you will see you can…..If you visit http://tristatebusinessnetwork.ning.com, you will see you can….

Tri State Business Network group is doing it…..and doing it very well.  Some may say that TBN is not always the ”most professional” because we love to have fun…we just do.  What is wrong with having fun while networking your business professionally?  Nothing..We all know why we are there…we all know what we need to do…and above all we love being there.  When you go to our online networking group, you will also see all the action going on.  Who would have thought that all these people wanted to change with TBN?  If you would have asked me a year ago, I would have told you that the online side was just bumping around….not anymore.  We have seen a huge increase in activity on our Member’s only site.  In October, we only had 8 blog posts.  In November, we had 37 blog posts.  Up to this point in December, we have 33 already.

As you can see, TBN members are getting it.  They understand how important it is to be online networking as well as, networking face to face.  You must have both to increase your networking next year…do you have more than 1 way to network your business next year? 

TBN Membership Benefits: $100 per year
1. Ability to attend any/all 28 meetings per month.  Member Directory site http://www.tristatebusinessnetwork.com
2. $25 referral fee per member you bring into TBN
3. 3 minute commercial once per quarter at any meeting you wish that week
4. E-Blast Communication between members for blogging, events, and other information you may need to get to other members you may not always see.
5. Member’s only website http://www.tristatebusinessnetwork.ning.com
6. TBN Education – we will teach you “How to build your profiles”, “How to communicate more effectively with the other TBN members” and “Why blog?”. This will allow you a better opportunity to market your business better through social media. TBN Education is FREE to paid Members.

Clayton R. Hicks

TBN Founder

D – 937-671-6238

http://www.tristatebusinessnetwork.com

http://tristatebusinessnetwork.ning.com

http://twitter.com/TBNfounder

http://www.linkedin.com/in/tbnfounder

Below is another article writtem before  Unholy Trinity, which I believe hits the nail right on the head. This is taken from  Shepherd’s Fellowship

(By John MacArthur)

Former NASDAQ chairman Bernie Madoff ran a ponzi-scheme swindle for nearly 20 years, and he bilked an estimated $18 billion from Wall-Street investors. When the scam finally came to light it unleashed a shockwave of outrage around the world. It was the largest and most far-reaching investment fraud ever.

But the evil of Madoff’s embezzlement pales by comparison to an even more diabolical fraud being carried out in the name of Christ under the bright lights of television cameras on religious networks worldwide every single day. Faith healers and prosperity preachers promise miracles in return for money, conning their viewers out of more than a billion dollars annually. They have operated this racket on television for more than five decades. Worst of all, they do it with the tacit acceptance of most of the Christian community.

Someone needs to say this plainly: The faith healers and health-and-wealth preachers who dominate religious television are shameless frauds. Their message is not the true gospel of Jesus Christ. There is nothing spiritual or miraculous about their on-stage chicanery. It is all a devious ruse designed to take advantage of desperate people. They are not godly ministers but greedy impostors who corrupt the Word of God for money’s sake. They are not real pastors who shepherd the flock of God but hirleings whose only design is to fleece the sheep. Their love of money is glaringly obvious in what they say as well as how they live. They claim to possess great spiritual power, but in reality they are rank materialists and enemies of everything holy.

There is no reason anyone should be deceived by this age-old con, and there is certainly no justification for treating the hucksters as if they were authentic ministers of the gospel. Religious charlatans who make merchandise of false promises have been around since the apostolic era. They pretend to be messengers of Christ, but they are interlopers and impostors. The apostles condemned them with the harshest possible language. Paul called them “men of corrupt minds and destitute of the truth, who suppose that godliness is a means of gain” (1 Timothy 6:5). Peter called them false prophets with “heart[s] trained in greed” (2 Peter 2:14). He warned that “in their greed they will exploit you with false words” (v. 3). He exposed them as scoundrels and dismissed them as “stains and blemishes” on the church (v. 13). 

Those biblical descriptions certainly fit the greed-driven cult of prosperity preachers and faith healers who unfortunately, thanks to television, have become the best-known face of Christianity worldwide. The scam they operate ought to be a bigger scandal than any Wall Street ponzi scheme or big-time securities fraud. After all, those who are most susceptible to the faith-healers’ swindle are not well-to-do investors but some of society’s most vulnerable people—including multitudes who are already destitute, disconsolate, disabled, elderly, sick, suffering, or dying. The faith-healer gets lavishly rich while the victims become poorer and more desperate (cf. Ezek. 34:1-4, 10).

But the worst part of the scandal is that it’s not really a scandal at all in the eyes of most evangelical Christians. Those who should be most earnest in defense of the truth have taken a shockingly tolerant attitude toward the prosperity preachers’ blatant misrepresentation of the gospel and their wanton exploitation of needy people. “But we don’t want to judge,” they say. Thus Christians fail to exercise righteous judgment (John 7:24). They refuse to be discerning at all.

How many manifestos and written declarations of solidarity have evangelicals issued condemning abortion, euthanasia, same-sex marriage, and other social evils? It’s fine, and fairly easy, to oppose wickedness and injustice in secular society, but where is the corresponding moral outrage against these religious mountebanks who openly, brashly pervert the gospel for profit 24 hours a day, seven days a week on international television?

Advocates of abortion and euthanasia don’t usually try to pass their message off as biblical. The people who say we need to redefine marriage haven’t portrayed themselves as an arm of the church. But the prosperity preachers deceive people in Jesus’ name, claiming to speak for God—while stealing both the souls and the sustenance of hurting people. That is a far greater abomination than any of the social evils Christians typically protest. After all, what the prosperity preachers do is not only a sin against poor, sick, and vulnerable people; it also blasphemes God, corrupts the gospel, and profanes the reputation of Christ before a watching world. It not only tears at the fabric of our society; it also befouls the purity of the visible church and abates the influence of the true gospel. It is surely among the grossest of all the evils currently rampant in our culture.

In the weeks to come, we’re going to be looking at the preposterous claims and false teachings of some of religious television’s best-known figures. We’ll analyze why a disproportionate number of celebrity faith-healers and prosperity preachers have succumbed to serious immorality. And we’ll see what Scripture says about how Bible-believing Christians ought to respond. I hope this series will challenge you to take a more active stand against the phony miracles and false teachings that are being peddled in the name of Christ.

(By John MacArthur)

I don’t watch much television, and when I do I generally avoid the Trinity Broadcasting Network (TBN). For many years TBN has been dominated by faith-healers, full-time fund-raisers, and self-proclaimed prophets spewing heresy. I wrote about the false gospel they proclaim and the phony miracles they pretend to do almost two decades ago in Charismatic Chaos (Grand Rapids: Zondervan, 1992. See especially chapter 12). I had my fill of charismatic televangelism while researching that book, and I can hardly bear to watch it any more.

Recently, however, while recovering from knee-replacement surgery, I decided to sample some of the current fare on TBN. From a therapeutic point of view it seemed a good choice: something more excruciating than the pain in my leg might distract me from the physical suffering of post-surgical trauma. And I suppose on that basis the strategy was effective.

But it left me outraged and frustrated—and eager to challenge the misperceptions in the minds of millions of unbelievers who see these false teachers masquerading as ministers of Christ on TBN.

I’m outraged at the brazen way so many false teachers twist the message of Scripture in Jesus’ name. And I’m frustrated because I’m certain that if these charlatans were not receiving a large proportion of their financial support from sincere believers (and silent acquiescence from Christian leaders who surely know better), they would have no platform for their shenanigans. They would soon lose their core constituency and fade from the scene.

Instead, religious quacks are actually multiplying at a frightening pace. One thing I discovered to my immense displeasure is that TBN is by no means the only religious network broadcasting poisonous false doctrine around the clock. The channel lineup I receive includes at least seven other channels whose schedules are filled with false teachers and charlatans. There’s The Church Channel, Daystar, GodTV, World Harvest Television (LeSEA), Total Christian Television, and several others. Some of them feature blocs of family television programing and a few fairly sound teachers who provide moments of escape from the prosperity preachers. But all of them give prominence to enormous amounts of heresy and religious claptrap—enough to make them positively dangerous. And TBN is singularly responsible for kicking that door open so wide.

The continued growth and influence of TBN is baffling for a number of reasons, not the least of which is the thick aura of lust, greed, and other kinds of moral impropriety that surrounds the whole enterprise. A long string of scandals involving notable charismatic televangelists between 1988 and 1992 should have been sufficient reason for even the most credulous viewers to scrutinize the entire industry with skepticism. First came the international spectacle of Jim and Tammy Faye Bakker’s moral, marital, and financial collapse. That was followed closely by the revelation of Jimmy Swaggart’s repeated dalliances with prostitutes. Shortly afterward, an episode of ABC’s Primetime Live exposed clear examples of deliberate fraud on the part of three more leading charismatic televangelists. Those incidents were punctuated by a score of lesser scandals over several years’ time. It is clear (or should be)—based on empirical evidence alone—that preachers promising miracles in exchange for money are not to be trusted. And for anyone who simply bothers to compare Jesus’ teaching with the health-and-wealth message, it is clear that the message that currently dominates religious television is “a different gospel; which is really not another” (Galatians 1:6-7), but a damnable lie.

TBN is by far the leading perpetrator of that lie worldwide. Virtually all the network’s main celebrities tell listeners that God will give them healing, wealth, and other material blessings in return for their money. On program after program people are urged to “plant a seed” by sending “the largest bill you have or the biggest check you can write” with the promise that God will miraculously make them rich in return. That same message dominates all of TBN’s major fundraising drives. It’s known as the “seed faith” plan, so-called by Oral Roberts, who set the pattern for most of the charismatic televangelists who have followed the trail he blazed. Paul Crouch, founder, chairman, and commander-in-chief of TBN, is one of the doctrine’s staunchest defenders.

The only people who actually get rich by this scheme, of course, are the televangelists. Their people who send money get little in return but phony promises—and as a result, many of them turn away from the truth completely.

If the scheme seems reminiscent of Tetzel, that’s because it is precisely the same doctrine. (Tetzel was a medieval monk whose high-pressure selling of indulgences—phony promises of forgiveness—outraged Martin Luther and touched off the Protestant Reformation.)

Like Tetzel, TBN preys on the poor and plies them with false promises. Yet what is happening daily on TBN is many times worse than the abuses that Luther decried because it is more widespread and more flagrant. The medium is more high-tech and the amounts bilked out of viewers’ pockets are astronomically higher. (By most estimates, TBN is worth more than a billion dollars and rakes in $200 million annually. Those are direct contributions to the network, not counting millions more in donations sent directly to TBN broadcasters.) Like Tetzel on steroids, the Crouches and virtually all the key broadcasters on TBN live in garish opulence, while constantly begging their needy viewers for more money. Elderly, poor, and working-class viewers constitute TBN’s primary demographic. And TBN’s fundraisers all know that. The most desperate people—”unemployed,” “even though I’m in between jobs,” “trying to make it; trying to survive,” “broke”—are baited with false promises to give what they do not even have. Jan Crouch addresses viewers as “you little people,” and suggests that they send their grocery money to TBN “to assure God’s blessing.”

Thus TBN devours the poor while making the charlatans rich. God cursed false prophets in the Old Testament for that very thing (Jeremiah 6:13-15). It’s also one of the main reasons the Pharisees incurred Jesus’ condemnation (Luke 20:46-47). It’s hard to think of any sin more evil. It not only hurts people materially; it deludes them with groundless hope, deceives them with a false gospel, and thereby places their souls in eternal peril. And yet those who do it pretend they are doing the work of God.

That’s not all. Almost no false prophecy, erroneous doctrine, rank superstition, or silly claim is too outlandish to receive airtime on TBN. Jan Crouch tearfully gives a fanciful account of how her pet chicken was miraculously raised from the dead. Benny Hinn trumps that claim with a bizarre prophecy that if TBN viewers will put their dead loved ones’ caskets in front of television set and touch the dead person’s hand to the screen, people will “be raised from the dead . . . by the thousands.”

Ironically, one doesn’t even need to be an orthodox Trinitarian in order to broadcast on the Trinity network. Bishop T. D. Jakes, well known for his rejection of the Nicene creed in favor of oneness Pentecostalism, is a staple on TBN. Benny Hinn has repeatedly attempted to revise the doctrine of the Trinity in novel ways, notoriously teaching at one point that there are nine persons in the godhead.

And yet evangelical church leaders typically show a kind of benign tolerance toward the whole enterprise. Most would never endorse it, of course. They may joke about the gaudiness of the big hair and tawdry set decorations on TBN. Ask them, and they will most likely acknowledge that the prosperity gospel is no gospel at all. Press the issue, and you will probably get them to admit that it is a dangerous form of false doctrine, totally unbiblical, and essentially anti-Christian.

Why, then, is there no large-scale effort among Bible-believing evangelicals to expose, denounce, refute, and silence these false teachers? After all, that is what Scripture commands church leaders to do when we encounter purveyors of soul-destroying substitutes for the true gospel:

The overseer must be above reproach as God’s steward, not self-willed, not quick-tempered, not addicted to wine, not pugnacious, not fond of sordid gain, but hospitable, loving what is good, sensible, just, devout, self-controlled, holding fast the faithful word which is in accordance with the teaching, so that he will be able both to exhort in sound doctrine and to refute those who contradict. For there are many rebellious men, empty talkers and deceivers, especially those of the circumcision, who must be silenced because they are upsetting whole families, teaching things they should not teach for the sake of sordid gain (Titus 1:7-11).

Those who remain silent in the face of such grotesque lies may in fact be partly responsible for turning people away from the truth. Consider the testimony of William Lobdell, religion reporter for the Los Angeles Times, who once considered himself a devout evangelical Christian, but after doing a series of investigative reports on the moral and doctrinal cesspool at TBN; then “finding that his investigative stories about faith healer Benny Hinn and televangelists Jan and Paul Crouch appear to make no difference on the reach of these ministries or the lives of their followers, he [gave] up on the beat and on religion generally.”

All those who truly love Christ and care about the truth have a solemn duty to defend the truth by exposing and opposing these lies that masquerade as truth. If we fail in that duty because of indifference, apathy, or a craving for the approval of men, we are no less guilty than those who actively spread the lies.

See part 1 here

by John MacArthur

I don’t watch much television, and when I do I generally avoid the Trinity Broadcasting Network (TBN). For many years TBN has been dominated by faith-healers, full-time fund-raisers, and self-proclaimed prophets spewing heresy. I wrote about the false gospel they proclaim and the phony miracles they pretend to do almost two decades ago in Charismatic Chaos (Grand Rapids: Zondervan, 1992. See especially chapter 12). I had my fill of charismatic televangelism while researching that book, and I can hardly bear to watch it any more.

Recently, however, while recovering from knee-replacement surgery, I decided to sample some of the current fare on TBN. From a therapeutic point of view it seemed a good choice: something more excruciating than the pain in my leg might distract me from the physical suffering of post-surgical trauma. And I suppose on that basis the strategy was effective.

But it left me outraged and frustrated—and eager to challenge the misperceptions in the minds of millions of unbelievers who see these false teachers masquerading as ministers of Christ on TBN.

continue reading here…

This particular event only happens once a year.  If you wouldn’t mind, I would like to tell you a little about what it means to the TBN Founder.

Christmas is the best holiday for me…I get to give and give and give with no regard for what my personal bank account may look like.  Are you a giver or a servant to others?  maybe you are and maybe you just give a little or serve a little to make yourself feel better about the meaning of Christmas. 

I was at my ministry training Saturday morning and the training was about what type of leader I was….(if I didn’t know by then, I guess I never really would lol).  They were doing personality tests and they figured out I was a director, duh!  But that really wasn’t what the meeting was about, it was about how we use our talents……(rewind just a little bit)

A month ago, we were in a vision meeting and I had told those in attendance that we needed to be more of a Servant, like Christ was..The crowd never flinched, because they didn’t get it. (fast forward to Saturday)

The leader of the class was just that…he was telling us how we needed to be more of a servant like Christ and the class started listening a little closer…..To much surprise, Gary said….”everyone take off your shoes and socks”, the crowd was kind of in an uproar at this request. (the story behind this test, was when Christ washed the feet of his disciples and they were shocked at his servitude and so were most of the 50 in our class)  You should have been there….some were saying I can’t, or I won’t, or they just grumbled…I just did what he said to do…(see “how to be a true leader and servant” read the Holy Bible for more information on that).

Gary then walked around the room and washed 5 people’s feet and the room became silent…we were then to talk about what just happened and speak our thoughts on this.

Here is mine….Be a servant with a servant’s heart…don’t be afraid to help others…don’t hesitate to help others…don’t hesitate to give money or time to those who need it….quit worrying about your bank accounts or your sales or how you will pay your bills or how you can be helped………………HELP OTHERS with an attitude of service……..help right now, don’t wait… just do it and do it with a BIG heart.  If you see someone on the side of the road begging for money, they must need it worse than you…If someone asks to borrow some money, they must need it or their PRIDE wouldn’t be shot.  We only live once and if you want to see your life change immediately…Care about others too.  You are to love yourself, but can you truly love yourself without loving others?  NO.  Don’t worry about how you help them, just help them.  Help me help them.  Be a GIVER, be a SERVANT, and with all your power have a MERRY CHRISTMAS and HAPPY HOLIDAYS. 

P.S. Once you become a Servant, you will beg for it to be Christmas everyday…:)  

Amen

Oral Roberts died this week and the obituaries have been abuzz with analyses of his life and legacy. The USA Today headline summed up his contributions this way: “Oral Roberts brought health-and-wealth Gospel mainstream.” The Los Angeles Times gave a similar snapshot of the man: “Oral Roberts dies at 91; televangelist was pioneering preacher of the ‘prosperity gospel’”

But Christianity Today’s lead blogger, Ted Olsen, disagreed. He responded with a post titled “Why the .” The long subtitle at the head of Olsen’s post explained: “The ‘faith-healer’ (who hated the term) may have done much to mainstream Pentecostalism, but he was no architect of the Prosperity Gospel.”

Olsen’s argument, essentially, is that the real founder and mastermind of prosperity doctrine was not Oral Roberts but Kenneth Hagin, “who is far more widely recognized as the man who joined Pentecostalism with the Faith Movement (also called ‘Word-Faith,’ or derogatively, the Prosperity Gospel or ‘Health and Wealth’ gospel).”

Olsen, however, is wrong. He has evidently confused two categories. It is quite true that Kenneth Hagin is the main prosperity preacher who popularized word-faith doctrine–the notion that the words we speak determine the blessings we receive. Hagin borrowed that doctrine from an earlier, lesser-known preacher–E. W. Kenyon. (A mountain of evidence suggests that Hagin actually plagiarized large portions of his published works from Kenyon’s writings.) Kenyon had been strongly influenced by the teachings of New Thought, a 19th-century metaphysical cult similar to Christian Science. So Hagin’s word-faith doctrines had deeply cultic roots, but the idea fit perfectly with the prosperity doctrines that were already being taught by A. A. Allen, Oral Roberts, Jack Coe, and other faith-healers. The two ideas were natural complements to one another.

Still, word-faith doctrine and the prosperity gospel are not synonymous. (Even the current Wikipedia entry acknowledges this: “Although [the Word of Faith movement] shares teachings in common with Prosperity theology, they are not the same thing.”) Prosperity doctrine is the notion that God’s favor is expressed mainly through physical health and material prosperity, and that these blessings are available for the claiming by anyone who has sufficient faith.

Oral Roberts was certainly the 20th century’s leading advocate of that idea. His prosperity doctrine laid the foundation for an enormous media-based religious system, and Oral Roberts was indeed its chief architect. It is preposterous that Christianity Today would try to whitewash that fact. Prosperity teaching was what Roberts himself wanted to be remembered for.

In Oral Roberts: An American Life, biographer David Edwin Harrell, Jr., describes how Roberts discovered the prosperity gospel and how it became the centerpiece of his message. One day he opened his Bible randomly and spotted 3 John 2: “Beloved, I wish above all things that thou mayest prosper and be in health, even as thy soul prospereth.” He showed it to his wife, Evelyn, and “They talked excitedly about the verse’s implications. Did it mean they could have a ‘new car,’ ‘a new house,’ a ‘brand-new ministry?’ In later years, Evelyn looked back on that morning as the point of embarkation: ‘I really believe that that very morning was the beginning of this worldwide ministry that he has had, because it opened up his thinking” [(Bloomington, IN: Indiana University, 1985), p. 66]. Roberts testified that a shiny new Buick, acquired by unexpected means shortly after that experience, “became a symbol to me of what a man could do if he would believe God.”

After he embraced prosperity doctrine, Oral Roberts’ best-known and most far-reaching brainchild was the Seed-Faith message. Roberts taught that money and material things donated to his organization were the seeds of prosperity and material blessings from God, and that God promises to multiply in miraculous ways whatever is given–and give many times more back to the donor. It was a simple, quasi-spiritual get-rich-quick scheme that appealed mainly to poor, disadvantaged, and desperate people. It generated untold millions for Roberts’ empire and was quickly adopted by a host of similarly-oriented Pentecostal and Charismatic media ministries. The Seed-Faith principle is the main cash-cow that built and has supported vast networks of televangelists who barter for their viewers’ money with fervent promises of “miracles”–and the miracles are invariably described in terms of material blessings, mainly money. Elsewhere I have compared this doctrine to the mentality of the post-WWII cargo cults.

Tragically, the Seed-Faith message usurped and utterly replaced whatever gospel content there ever may have been in Oral Roberts’ preaching. In all the many times I saw him on television I never once heard him preach the gospel. His message–every time–was about Seed-Faith. The reason for that is obvious: the message of the cross–an atoning sacrifice for sins wrought through Jesus’ sufferings–frankly doesn’t mesh very well with the notion that God guarantees health, wealth, and prosperity to the righteous. Our fellowship in Jesus’ sufferings (Philippians 3:10), and our duty to follow in His steps (1 Peter 2:20-23), are likewise antithetical to the core principles of prosperity doctrine. The prosperity message is a different gospel (cf. Galatians 1:8-9).

One leading charismatic figure this week stated that without Oral Roberts’ influence, “the entire charismatic movement might not have occurred.” That may well be true. For that very reason, Roberts’ legacy needs to be evaluated soberly, honestly, and carefully, under the stark light of Scripture. Was the message he proclaimed the unadulterated gospel? Though he eschewed the label, Roberts made his main reputation on television in the 1950s as a faith-healer, and he even claimed to have raised multiple people from the dead. Were those “miracles” real and verifiable? Did his best-known and most staggering “prophecies” prove to be true? Was he himself a credible man?

The answer to all those questions is an unambiguous no. Oral Roberts’ influence is not something Bible-believing Christians should celebrate. Virtually every abberant idea the Pentecostal and charismatic movements spawned after 1950 can be traced in one way or another to Oral Roberts’ influence. (What the CT blog fails to mention is that Kenneth Hagin and Oral Roberts often ministered together and affirmed one another’s ministries. Furthermore, the heir to Hagin’s standing as chief of the word-faith preachers is Kenneth Copeland, who went into television ministry after working as chauffeur and pilot to Oral Roberts. So even though it would not be quite accurate to portray Oral Roberts as an aggressive proponent of word-faith doctrines, he acted as more of an ally than an opponent to the movement. We might say his relationship with that movement was reminiscent of a benign grandfather who refused to correct an out-of-control grandchild.)

One thing all the obituaries agree on is that Oral Roberts paved the way for all the charismatic televangelists and faith-healers who dominate religious television today. He did more than anyone in the early Pentecostal movement to influence mainstream evangelicalism. He parlayed his television ministry into a vast empire that has left a deep mark on the church worldwide. In many places today, including some of the world’s most illiterate and poverty-stricken regions, Oral Roberts’ Seed-Faith concept is actually better known than the doctrine of justification by faith. The message of prosperity is now the message multitudes think of when they hear the word “gospel.” Countless confused people worldwide think of the gospel as a message about earthly, temporal, and material riches rather than the infinitely greater blessings of forgiveness from sin and the eternal blessing of the believer’s spiritual union with Christ.

All of those are reasons to lament rather than celebrate Oral Roberts’ fame and influence. My prayer is that future generations will see the folly of those doctrines, renounce and turn away from them, and cling tightly to the sure word of God and the glorious, eternal promises of the true gospel.

http://www.shepherdsfellowship.org/pulpit/Posts.aspx?ID=4482

A bad economy is never a good thing…….or is it? God used swarms of locusts to destroy the crops in Judah, in order that the people would stop depending on the sacrifices in the temple to cover their sins, and return to obedience to YHVH. Joel 1:13-14–“Gird yourselves and lament, you priests; wail, you who minister before the altar; come, lie all night in sackcloth, you who minister to my God; for the grain offering and the drink offering are withheld from the house of your God. Consecrate a fast, call a sacred assembly; gather the elders and all the inhabitants of the land into the house of the LORD your God, and cry out to the LORD.”

Well, now, all those who have “sown” into Rod Parsley’s “ministry” in order to get their “abundance” and their “breakthrough” may have to send their money elsewhere. Seems that things aren’t going so good in the Rod Parsley House of Heresy™ (from the Columbus [OH] Dispatch):

The headline of the appeal for donations reads: “Will you help me take back what the devil stole?”

When asked to comment yesterday, Parsley’s World Harvest Church issued a statement saying the recession caused a decline in member giving in 2009, which has led to a fourth-quarter deficit of $3 million despite a 30 percent reduction in the budget.

This year, the church settled for $3.1 million with a family whose son was spanked at its day-care center in 2006, to the point his buttocks and legs were covered with welts and abrasions.

The boy, then 2, said he was spanked with a “knife” by a substitute teacher. His parents, Michael and Lacey Faieta, believe it was a ruler.

Yeah, the devil stole that money, alright. He used Rod Parsley to steal that money from people who could least deserve to lose it.

Perhaps Rod can put his money where his mouth is (pun intended), practice what he preaches, and “sow a seed” into a ministry that takes the gospel to the poor and the sick. And by “gospel” I mean the REAL gospel–the one that says we are dead sinners who need the blood of Christ to pay the debt we owe to God. Not the heretical “prosperity” gibberish that spews from Parsley’s mouth.

God in a Box, WoF Quotes, Part 4 by Yodas Prodigy

Here is PART ONE, PART, TWO, PART THREE

God is not sovereign in Word Faith Theology.

Below are some issues that Dr Marinelli should have grappled with including the following concepts espoused by the Word Faith Fathers:

E.W. Kenyon

“It seems that God is limited by our prayer life, that He can do nothing for humanity unless someone asks Him to do it. Why this is, I do not know.” (“The Two Kinds of Faith,” p. 42).

Kenneth Hagin

a. “Originally, God made the earth and the fullness thereof, giving Adam dominion over all the works of His hands. In other words, Adam was the god of this world. (Kenneth Hagin, “The Believer’s Authority, 1987, p. 19)

b. Therefore, Adam had dominion upon this earth and in this world. He was originally, in a sense, god of this world. But Satan came and lied to Adam. Adam committed high treason and sold out to Satan. Then Satan became the god of this world. (Hagin, “The Art of Intercession,” 1980, p.3; reissued as “The Art of Prayer” both 1992 and 2000 editions contain the same teaching.

c. “I began to examine the Bible to find out why, if God wants to do something for humanity, He cannot unless somebody asks Him.” (Hagin, Ibid, p. 1).

d. “God cannot legally and justly move in and take away that dominion from the devil. The devil has dominion here. He has a right. He has Adam’s lease. And God cannot do anything unless somebody down here asks Him.” (Ibid, p. 3).

Kenneth Copeland

a. “God’s reason for creating Adam was His desire to reproduce Himself. I mean a reproduction of Himself, and in the Garden of Eden He did just that.” (“Following the Faith of Abraham,” side 1).

b. (speaking after the Fall) “God had no avenue of lasting faith or moving in the earth. He had to have covenant with somebody. He had to be invited in, in other words, or He couldn’t come.” (“God’s Covenants With Man II,” side 1).

c. (Speaking about God and Abraham – God speaking) “I’m making a proposition to you. You can tell me to bug off if you don’t like it.” (Ibid, side 2).

Charles Capps

a. “God said, “Let us make man IN OUR IMAGE AFTER OUR LIKENESS.” The word, likeness, in the original Hebrew meant ‘an exact duplication in kind.’ (“Authority In Three Worlds,” p. 17).

Fred Price

“God can’t do anything in this earth realm except what we, the body of Christ, allow Him to do.” (Audiotape PR #11)

Source Quotes supplied by Bill Brown of D.T.S. (http://www.christiandiscussionforums…ad.php?t=84069 )

I would like to now close this series with a final comment. Dr. Marinelli’s work had so many errors that it would have taken a book of equal volume to correct his mistakes. I chose to select the most obvious errors. I hope that you will take the time to compare my series with the actual work of Dr. Chad Marinelli found elsewhere in this site.

Dr. Marinelli’s Thesis: http://www.light-after-darkness.org/index.php?page=wof

God in a Box, A Review Part 3 by Yodas Prodigy

HERE ARE PART ONE AND PART TWO

Dr. Marinelli’s Thesis: http://www.light-after-darkness.org/index.php?page=wof

Satan needed God’s permission to attack Job. Despite the crowing of Word Faith supporters, Satan admitted that Job had a hedge of protection around him (Job 1:9). It is obvious that God removed that hedge of protection in order for Satan to attack.

Remember also, God told Satan everything of Job’s is yours. Do not touch him. So the first attack was against everything that Job had except his wife. Why, because Satan did not have permission to do anything else. The second time, Satan had permission to attack Job’s flesh. But he could not kill him. Each time, God was asked by Satan for permission.

Job is far more than Dr. Marinelli can understand using his Word Faith perspective. He was a man who had control of his thoughts, Job 31:1. His sacrifices for his children are considered acts of fear. Yet, Abraham and Noah made the same types of sacrifices. See Genesis 8:20; 15:9-10. Also note that each time Job was attacked, he did not sin (Job 1:22 and 2:10) Even when God had chastised Job for his self-righteousness, God did not require a sacrifice for Job, only his friends (Job 42:7). I would like to also point out, each time Dr. Marinelli quoted Job when one of his friends were speaking, they were considered to be errant by God.

How righteous was Job? Well God clearly places him right up there with Daniel and Noah in Ezekiel 14:14 and 20. A New Testament writer, James, points out Job’s patience demonstrated during his suffering (James 5:11).

Themes of Job could be, “The Problem of Suffering of a Righteous Person” or “The Purpose of Chastening in the Hands of a Sovereign God”. Job clearly saw the sovereignty of God at the end, “I know that you can do all things; no plan of yours can be thwarted. (Job 42:1)” If were up to Word Faith, the theme of Job would be, “It’s really your entire fault.”

As chapter six continues, Dr. Marinelli says on page 151, “The destroyer was the direct executor of the plague, not God.” I am not sure why Dr. Marinelli has to go to such extent to absolve God from being directly involved with the Destroyer. Let’s see what the scriptures say, “This is what the Lord says; ‘About midnight I will go throughout Egypt. Every firstborn son in Egypt will die, from the firstborn son of Pharaoh, who sits on the throne, to the first born son of the slave girl…’” (Exodus 11:4). Exodus 15:26 clearly has God admitting to causing the diseases that Egypt had experienced. Dr. Marinelli does later agree that God does create destroyers for specific purposes. Yet, the Egyptian example he tries to leave God out of the fray. I should remind Dr. Marinelli that God will one day judge all created beings and will do far worse to the non-elect than some plague.

Based on Word Faith interpretation (Page 153), Ananias and Saphira are placed into the hands of Satan after they lied to the Holy Spirit (Acts 5). Why would Satan want to destroy someone who has just done his bidding to God? This was a Holy judgment by the Holy Spirit. God could not have people lying to him in front of everyone. His holiness was violated. So the judge of all mankind made a judgment.

A similar event happened in the Old Testament. The Ark was being brought back to David (2 Samuel 6:7) and Uzzah touched it before it was to hit the ground. Uzzah violated God’s holiness and he was struck down. This was God’s doing, not Satan’s.

Final Comments and Summary

As you research Dr. Marinelli, you will see that his doctorate is from a diploma mill. He lacks in his hermeneutic approach, research abilities, and exegetic skills. At best, he is a neophyte in the world of theology. Being a neophyte myself, it is easy to see those who charade as doctors. Very few of the Doctor’s sources are from a scholarly level. I leave it up to you the reader to decide whether Mr. Marinelli’s thesis is worth a doctorate.

Here is PART ONE

Dr. Marinelli’s Thesis: http://www.light-after-darkness.org/index.php?page=wof

I quote from the Westminster Confession Faith (Dr. Marinelli also used the W.C.F. as a source):

God from all eternity did, by the most wise and holy counsel of His own will, freely, and unchangeably ordain whatsoever comes to pass (Rom_9:15, Rom_9:18; Rom_11:33; Eph_1:11; Heb_6:17): yet so, as thereby neither is God the author of sin (Jam_1:13, Jam_1:17; 1Jo_1:5), nor is violence offered to the will of the creatures, nor is the liberty or contingency of second causes taken away, but rather established (Pro_16:33; Mat_17:12; Joh_19:11; Act_2:23; Act_4:27, Act_4:28). WCF 3:1

Although God knows whatsoever may or can come to pass upon all supposed conditions (Mat_11:21, Mat_11:23; Act_15:18; 1Sa_23:11, 1Sa_23:12), yet hath He not decreed any thing because He foresaw it as future, or as that which would come to pass upon such conditions (Rom_9:11, Rom_9:13, Rom_9:16, Rom_9:18). WCF 3:2

The WCF clearly demonstrates the Reformed position that Dr. Marinelli chose to ignore in his research.

He also makes the logical jump that Calvinism teaches that God is the author of sin. Dr. Marinelli says, “God does not ordain every sin we commit as Christians, as Calvinism teaches. This would make God the author of sin.” The following is Footnote 15 on page 20:

“God not only foresaw that Adam would fall, but also ordained that he should … I confess it is a horrible decree; yet no one can deny but God foreknew Adam’s fall, and therefore foreknew he had ordained it so by his own decree” (Calvin’s Institutes, book 3, chapter 23, section 7).

You will note that the author only took a small piece of the quote. Here is the whole quote:

7. They deny that it is ever said in distinct terms, God decreed that Adam should perish by his revolt.50[5] As if the same God, who is declared in Scripture to do whatsoever he pleases, could have made the noblest of his creatures without any special purpose. They say that, in accordance with free-will, he was to be the architect of his own fortune, that God had decreed nothing but to treat him according to his desert. If this frigid fiction is received, where will be the omnipotence of God, by which, according to his secret counsel on which every thing depends, he rules over all? But whether they will allow it or not, predestination is manifest in Adam’s posterity. It was not owing to nature that they all lost salvation by the fault of one parent. Why should they refuse to admit with regard to one man that which against their will they admit with regard to the whole human race? Why should they in caviling lose their labour? Scripture proclaims that all were, in the person of one, made liable to eternal death. As this cannot be ascribed to nature, it is plain that it is owing to the wonderful counsel of God. It is very absurd in these worthy defenders of the justice of God to strain at a gnat and swallow a camel. I again ask how it is that the fall of Adam involves so many nations with their infant children in eternal death without remedy unless that it so seemed meet to God? Here the most loquacious tongues must be dumb. The decree, I admit, is, dreadful; and yet it is impossible to deny that God foreknow what the end of man was to be before he made him, and foreknew, because he had so ordained by his decree. Should any one here inveigh against the prescience of God, he does it rashly and unadvisedly. For why, pray, should it be made a charge against the heavenly Judge, that he was not ignorant of what was to happen? Thus, if there is any just or plausible complaint, it must be directed against predestination. Nor ought it to seem absurd when I say, that God not only foresaw the fall of the first man, and in him the ruin of his posterity; but also at his own pleasure arranged it. For as it belongs to his wisdom to foreknow all future events, so it belongs to his power to rule and govern them by his hand. This question, like others, is skillfully explained by Augustine: “Let us confess with the greatest benefit, what we believe with the greatest truth, that the God and Lord of all things who made all things very good, both foreknow that evil was to arise out of good, and knew that it belonged to his most omnipotent goodness to bring good out of evil, rather than not permit evil to be, and so ordained the life of angels and men as to show in it, first, what free-will could do; and, secondly, what the benefit of his grace and his righteous judgment could do,” (August. Enchir. ad Laurent).

John Calvin’s point was summed up in the quote of Augustine.
Whether the good Doctor agrees or disagrees with Calvinism, he needs to do better research and give an accurate view of Calvinism. Calvinism teaches that man has no interest in God (Romans 1 and 2). And, if God does not make alive a man’s spirit (Ephesians 2:1, 8-9), he will continue in his unbelief and continue lacking any desire to serve God.

At this point, I will let the reader know that this is a ploy by the Word Faith apologist to place blame on Calvinists for the criticism of their doctrines. Orthodox Apologists like to call this playing the “C” card. It is so much easier to blame Reformed believers than to take a serious look at their doctrine. As a side note, the other “C” card that is often played is the Cessation-ist card. This is where defenders of Word Faith will claim that a critic doesn’t understand because they have not had the Pentecostal/Charismatic experience. Therefore, they can’t experience or understand this revelation knowledge.

Having said this “C”-card stuff, the first critics of Word Faith has been Charismatics themselves – Gordon Fee, D.R. McConnell, and Hobart Freeman. In fact, when I was in the Word Faith Movement, I got my warnings from other Word Faith Charismatics. Most non-Charismatics were ignorant of the movement.

The rest of chapter two is setting up the straw man and beating it down. Dr. Marinelli does it numerous times..

Chapter six, Sovereignty, Suffering, and Sickness, can be a difficult subject. Most Christians believe that God answers prayers including healing. The Word Faith position is that a believer should live a life free of illness. It really comes down to your being sick is somehow your fault. Either you lack faith, committed some sin, are ignorant, or are being attacked by Satan.

Now, I agree that all four can be a reason for illness. Yet, even when we are doing well in the Word Faith checklist, illness does occur. We are subject to headaches caused by changes in the weather, to colds and flues that spread during the winter months. Our digestive system can get out of whack even when eating healthy foods. You will not find an honest Word Faith person who denies experiencing these things over the last year or two. The only thing to keep them quiet would be their fear of a negative confession. You may have heard from Word Faith circles, “Your confession is your possession.”

Job became the whipping boy of the Word Faith Movement early on. Despite Dr. Marinelli’s more respectable approach, he still comes down on Job. He admits on Page 145 that “He (Satan) viciously enters the presence of God looking for permission to destroy.” Interestingly enough, Dr. Marinelli’s Footnote 108 adds, “Of course, we have already established that Satan has permission to destroy, being the prince and powers of the air, the god of this age, who legally took, Adam’s dominion.” Dr. Marinelli also is quick to point out that Job had fear (Job 3:25) and this is what opened the door for Satan.

As the return of the Lord Jesus Christ is nearing and the age is also closing in on the schemes of satan – he is working fast around the human clock to spread his deceptions and heresies.

While it is evidently quite difficult for Satan to lure believers into heinous sinful activities – he’s found other means of getting to them right from their pulpits. He is using the means of heresies and even heretic preachers to divert Christians from their primary mission – God.

The Word of Faith Movement has been at the very front of promoting doctrines or teachings that are nowhere taught in Scripture. These men and women distort many passages of the Bible to propagate their own ideas rather than the clearly revealed Word of God.

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God in a Box, A Review Part 1 by Yodas Prodigy

Opening Statement

My review is in regards to the work authored by Chad Marinelli, “God in a Box?” Dr. Marinelli offers an apologetic for the Word Faith Movement’s view on God’s sovereignty and how man fits in to that sovereignty.

Dr. Marinelli’s Thesis: http://www.light-after-darkness.org/index.php?page=wof

You will note that I did not cover the entire work of Chad Marinelli. It would have taken an equal volume of effort to respond to all of his errors.

The Review

“The Cloudy Waters” is the title of chapter one. I will demonstrate that it is Dr. Marinelli who is muddying the waters and not those who consider themselves orthodox believers.

Dr. Marinelli starts off in his introduction by explaining first that the critics do not understand Word Faith. Rightfully, Dr. Marinelli identifies the gospel based on scripture. He quotes 1 Corinthians 15:1-4. He then says, “Anything that contradicts these basic elements of the Gospel is “heresy”, but we should resist going beyond these in pursuit of heresy.” (P. 7). The author seems to be ignorant of both history and competing belief systems. The Church created confessions that represent scripture due to the numerous errors it had to defend against. These confessions discuss the Trinity, the Person and Work of Christ, and many other doctrines related to the Church and Man. Groups that get these wrong include: Jehovah’s Witnesses, Latter Day Saints (Mormons), and the Oneness Pentecostals. So, history has demonstrated that the Church has had to go beyond what the author believes to be necessary. Would Dr. Marinelli dare raise these points against the Early Church Fathers?

These confessions can be seen at: http://www.light-after-darkness.org/index.php?page=OB.

On page 11, foot note 6, Dr. Marinelli discusses, in short, one of the two main heretical teachings found within the Word Faith Movement. Known as JDS, Jesus Died Spiritually, or BAJ, the Born-Again Jesus Doctrine, this doctrine teaches that Christ took on Satan’s nature and had to be Born-Again.

This heretical idea comes from E.W. Kenyon and marches straight through Word Faith history, being taught by Kenneth Hagin, Kenneth Copeland, and many of their offspring. This teaching is well documented in early works such as:

The Born-Again Jesus of the Faith Movement, Judith Matta
JDS: The Jesus Died Spiritually Heresy, Hobart Freeman

Other writers also discussed this topic. They are Gordon Fee, D.R. McConnell, Hank Haanegraft, and Robert Bowman.

Now, setting the stage, Dr. Marinelli would rather muddy the waters by saying, “The point being made here is that many historical evangelicals have taught that Christ was “forsaken”, or separated from the Father’s fellowship on the cross, and viewed as a sinner.” He intentionally tries to imply that the JDS/BAJ doctrine is similar to orthodox positions held by many within the Church because similar terminology is used. Dr. Marinelli glosses over the re-defining that is made by Word Faith teachers have done regarding “Spiritual Death”. They have re-defined it by saying Christ took on Satan’s nature.

The position held by the Reformers is that “Spiritual Death” is falling out of favor with God. Many other evangelicals teach that “Spiritual Death” is a separation from God. Can the casual reader see the difference between the orthodox believers and the Word Faith teachers?

You will find this tactic used by Word Faith apologists regularly. They have a presupposition regarding a doctrine, and then they hunt and peck to find scriptures and other others who have seemingly taught the same thing. Ted Clore, of Light-After-Darkness (http://www.light-after-darkness.org/ ), writes in response to this tactic, “I am not commenting on the authenticity or the motive of the translations, but instead pointing out how Word-Faith apologist and theology operates, seeking from any source something that confirms its assumptions. Building his apology by finding sources he can read his presupposition into. Any source will do, and if it says what the apologist’s assumes in his belief, it is appealed to for authority to legitimize his theology. The stated purpose and intent of those that have supplied the materials is discarded, and the eclectic reads his views into the sources.”

This eclectic hermeneutic is also used in creation of this second heretical doctrine held by the Word Faith Movement that you are a god. Dr. Marinelli defends Kenneth Copeland by using a quote by Athanasius on pages 11 and 12, “Yet, Athanasius claimed, ‘God became man that we might be made God.’ Why was he not condemned for deifying man, as Kenneth Copeland was for calling believers ‘little gods’. (sic)”
Let’s first look at what the Bible teaches regarding man being a god. Jesus answered a group of Jews and said, “Is it not written in your law, ‘I said, you are gods.’” Does this mean that humans can become God?

This text should not be used to support the view that we are (or can become) little gods, for such an interpretation is contrary to the overall context. Jesus is not speaking to pantheists (who believe that God is everything and everything is God) or polytheists (who believe in many gods). Rather, he is addressing strict Jewish monotheists who believe that only the Creator of the universe is God. So, his statement should not be wrenched out of this monotheistic context and given a pantheistic or polytheistic twist. The obvious understanding is that as a “Judge”, one presides over others as like God.

Additionally, scripture further clarifies the subject with Acts 14:11-15 (NIV)
11When the crowd saw what Paul had done, they shouted in the Lycaonian language, “The gods have come down to us in human form!” 12Barnabas they called Zeus, and Paul they called Hermes because he was the chief speaker. 13The priest of Zeus, whose temple was just outside the city, brought bulls and wreaths to the city gates because he and the crowd wanted to offer sacrifices to them.
14But when the apostles Barnabas and Paul heard of this, they tore their clothes and rushed out into the crowd, shouting: 15″Men, why are you doing this? We too are only men, human like you. We are bringing you good news, telling you to turn from these worthless things to the living God, who made heaven and earth and sea and everything in them.

Based on the previous scriptural quote, perhaps Dr. Marinelli should have heeded his own words from page 49, “Therefore the only safe historical point of reference to use is that of the book of Acts – a history of the first converts.

Now the quote in total that Dr. Marinelli uses, “The Orthodox concept of salvation as deification undergirded the contemplative methodology implied in the illumination view. Only the “pure in heart” see God, and purity comes only by divine grace in the economy of redemption. Those who are redeemed through the incarnation, whom the NT designates “sons of God” and “partakers of the divine nature,” are deified; that is, they become created, in contrast to uncreated, gods. “God became man that we might be made God,” said Athanasius of Alexandria; and Maximus Confessor declared: “All that God is, except for an identity in nature, one becomes when one is deified by grace.” With this personalistic view of salvation, Orthodoxy diverged from the juridical emphasis which the West inherited through Augustine of Hippo, whom Orthodoxy could not comfortably accept as a Doctor of the Church. Orthodox theology viewed man as called to know God and share his life, to be saved, not by God’s external activity or by one’s understanding of propositional truths, but by being himself deified.” The idea of man literally becoming a god is not implied in the text.

No where do they have powers to create with their tongues something out of nothing. These men simply see themselves as partaking of the Divine nature and having had their natures changed. Bowman pointed out 20 years ago that the doctrines of deification allegedly taught in the Eastern Orthodox Church were not from the aspect of man ‘becoming’ a god but from the aspect of a man (such as Moses) manifesting the power of God. The term was thus clearly metaphorical. Now, I will add, Kenneth Copeland comes from a westernized Protestant background. To use the Eastern Orthodox to support his errant theology is a red herring.

Starting chapter two, page 15, Dr. Marinelli says, “Similarly, we uphold the fact that God alone is the supreme sovereign ruler of the universe. God has created the universe and every natural law, spiritual law, and commandment in existence, based on His good pleasure. Within our failure to meet the conditions of these laws and commandments, God remains sovereign.”

Later in chapter two, the author sets the stage by committing the sin that he accuses the Word Faith critics of making. In his discussion, Dr. Marinelli misrepresents Calvinism with a Straw-man argument. And, he quotes only part of what Calvin writes. This has been the M.O. of many of Word Faith apologists. One of the endorsers of his book is Word Faith apologist Troy Edwards Sr. of “Victory through the Word Ministries”, who employs this very same tactic. Please visit CARM, the Christian Apologetics Research Ministry at www.christiandiscussionforums.org to witness for yourself. To read, go to the Word Faith section located in the Heterodox Forums.

Dr. Marinelli claims that Calvinism teaches that God forces unbelievers to go to Hell. Dr. Marinelli says on page 18, “He supposedly never draws the Hell-bound folks to grace, forcing them to remain in their helpless state of spiritual death.” (emphasis mine)

russell-kelly@att.net
www.tithing-russkelly.com
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Tithing-Study/

From How2BecomeAChristian.com

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Dr. Marinelli is the owner of wordoffaithanswers.com

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Marinelli: I have never seen a hard and fast rule of 10% explicitly stated in the New Testament as a commandment.

Kelly: That is because none exists. If it did, and, if tithing were legitimate, then tithe-recipients would not be allowed to own property and would have to kill anybody who dared to worship God directly per Numbers 18:21-29.

Marinelli: This matter of tithing is similar to the discussion of the Sabbath (See my Q&A about the Sabbath). The Sabbath was a type of our rest of faith (Hebrews 4), and has been since replaced with the first day of the week for worship (Acts 20:7).

Kelly: The Sabbath of Hebrews 4:3 is a type of the Creation Sabbath which lasted until Adam sinned. The 7th day Sabbath was only given to national Israel per Ex 31:13-17. Sunday does not replace the Sabbath commandment as part of the Law. According to Hebrews 8:13 the entire Old Covenant Law vanished at Calvary.

Marinelli: The New Testament shouts aloud of our freedom in Christ. We aren’t bound by ritualistic observances.

Kelly: Tithing was the most important ritualistic statute-ordinance-ceremonial law because it enabled the priesthood to exist. It was not a moral law.

Marinelli: The reason the Sabbath was supra-ritualistic is that God related it to His creation week in Genesis. This distinction made it more of a higher law than a mere ritualistic one. Such higher laws have fulfillment in the New Testament and some sort of replacements.

Kelly: The Sabbath was not a higher law. The 7th day Sabbath was the least important of all Sabbaths and required the least amount of sacrifices per Lev 23.

Marinelli: I believe the idea of the tithe also transcends ritualism because God references it as an acknowledgment of Him being the owner of all things and king over all creation.

Kelly: I disagree. True biblical tithes were holy because they came only from God’s miraculous increase of food from inside His holy land of Israel. No holy tithe could come from defiled pagan lands and no holy tithe could come from that which man’s skill produced. Jesus, Peter and Paul did not qualify as tithe-payers. While God was over all creation he only accepted holy tithes from inside Israel. That is ignored today.

Marinelli: In the Old Testament we see the importance of the tithe:

1) Abraham gave king Melchizedek a tithe of all he had, in honor of God the “possessor of Heaven and earth” (Gen 14:18-20).

Kelly: Melchizedek was the priest of El Elyon who was also the very common Most High God of all pagans of his time. The Canaanite god El and his son Baal also had the tithe of “possessor of heaven and earth.” Mariknelli’s statement does not prove that the “historical” Melchizedek even knew God as LORD, Yahweh, Jehovah.

Marinelli: Hebrews 7 extensively discusses the tithe from Abraham to Melchizedek as being a tithe offered to one far greater than the Levitical priesthood — namely Christ, the high priest of the order of Melchizedek.

Kelly: Hebrews 7 uses tithing as a vehicle to demonstrate that Jesus’ high priesthood replaced the Aaronic priesthood. It also uses types. It is not a command for the Church to switch tithing from Aaron to Jesus. In fact, the “necessary change of the law” mentioned in 7:12 results in its “annulment” in 7:18 from 7:5. The “change” was to “abolish” tithing.

Marinelli: 2) In ancient times, the tithe was an acknowledgement of your submission to a king. The usage of consecrated tithes existed among the Greeks, Romans, Carthaginians, and Arabians.

Kelly: Yes, but this disproves your argument. Tithes were common before Abraham in pagan religions which also worshiped idols, the heavens, offered child sacrifices and practiced temple prostitution. Since none of those are moral, this is not an argument that tithing was moral merely because it was very old and very common.

Marinelli: In 1 Samuel 8 we have the account of Israel demanding a king. God warned the people that a king would demand ten percent from them (1 Sam 8:15-17). This shows that ten percent was normally due to the king — whether earthly or heavenly.

Kelly: The king’s tithe was not holy –it was the first tenth of everything –including persons. According to 1 Chronicles 23 to 26 the king collected the Levitical tithe and used it as a political tax. This is ignored today.

Marinelli: 3) Jacob (Israel), as an acknowledgement of Jehovah’s protection and provision, vowed to give a tenth (Gen 28:20-22).

Kelly: Wrong. The supplantor and schemer set the conditions and told God what to do. His “tithes” came from the defiled pagan land of Haran and are not the same as holy tithes under the law.

Marinelli: … Are we not Jacob’s descendants spiritually (Gal 3:29, Rom 9:6)?

Kelly: You are trying to manipulate God’s Word. Gal 3:29 refers to Abraham, not Jacob, and it does not refer to tithing if Abraham were required to give a tithe to his local priest-king from spoils of war or as a passage tax.

Marinelli: Based on our identity in Jacob and God’s faithfulness to Jacob and his descendants, it would follow that we should vow to God in a similar manner (at least in a similar willingness, if not amount)?

Kelly: Should we attempt to outsmart God and set the conditions by telling Him what to do? I seriously doubt it.

Marinelli: Perhaps our vow should be even more than ten percent since we have a better covenant than ancient Israel, established on better promises (Heb 8:6).

Kelly: Pure speculation. The only people required to begin their level of giving at ten per cent were food producers who lived inside Israel. You are building a straw man on a false assumption.

Marinelli: 4) Jesus acknowledged that the tithing of the Pharisees was a noble thing, but they were ignoring the weightier matters such as mercy, faith, etc. (Mt 23:23).

Kelly: The Pharisees had abused the Law and had made it a burden by adding garden spices to tithing requirements. Jesus lived and died under the jurisdiction of the law and must teach full obedience to it until Calvary. in Matthew 23:23 he was teaching about “matters of the law.” He was not addressing Gentiles or the Church because it was illegal for Gentiles to pay tithes to the Temple system.

Marinelli: I do understand that this is not an extremely strong argument for or against the tithe, since this narrative occurs prior to His establishment of the New Covenant (and vanishing of the Old), being prior to Christ’s death. [Heb 8:13]

Kelly: Then why did you even mention it?

Marinelli: 5) Proverbs 3:9-10 tells us “Honour the LORD with thy substance, and with the firstfruits of all thine increase. So shall thy barns be filled with plenty, and thy presses shall burst out with new wine”.

Kelly: Firstfruits were never the same as tithes. Firstfruits were a small token offering of the FIRST. Tithes were one tenth of God’s miracle increase of food counted at the end of the harvest. See Deu 26:1-4 and Neh 10:35-38. It is diabolical to make poor Christians think that their first ten per cent must go to the church when Paul told Timothy in 1st Timothy 5:8 that one’s first should be used to buy medicine, food and essential shelter. How many poor do without medicine and food because of this lie?

Marinelli: I believe that Proverbs are directly relevant for today, as many of them are quoted directly in the New Testament. Part of Proverbs 3 is even quoted in Hebrews 12. Therefore I have to believe that this proverb is useful and profitable — a general principle for all time. It doesn’t give a specific percent to give, but it does claim that we should give of our income back to God, and thus “Honour” Him.

Kelly: The words “tithe, tithes, tithing” do not occur in Proverbs. Quotations of whole Proverbs are very rare in the NT. Their ideas are common to all knowledge and written by inspiration.

Marinelli: In addition, by doing so, God will fill our barns with plenty. It is a beautiful picture of Matthew 6:33 — seek His kingdom first, even financially (prior to spending a dime for anything else) — Give of our first fruits back to the very owner of it all. Jesus said, “For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also” (Mt 6:21).

Kelly: Jesus told the rich young ruler and Zaccheus to give their wealth to the poor.

Marinelli: If our heart places Christ first, then we will naturally give the “first fruits” of our income back to God as an acknowledgment of Him being first in every area of life, including financial. If we spend our money on our own pleasures, and then see what is left for God, we demonstrate that His kingdom is not a priority in our lives.

Kelly: Sounds good, but it is not biblical. 1 Tim 5:8 But if any provide not for his own, and especially for those of his own house, he hath denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel.

Marinelli: With these emphases in mind, I believe the tithe (as the Sabbath) is fulfilled in Christ, yet replaced with giving on the first day of the week “as God hath prospered” us (1 Cor 16:2) – a percentage based giving.

Kelly: There is not a single text where tithing was repeated to the Church after Calvary in terms of grace and faith in the New Covenant. Period. According to Hebrews 7:5, 12, 18 tithing was not “replaced” — it was “annulled.” Both 1 Cor 16:2 and 2 Cor 8 and 9 are discussions of food for famine relief in Judea. They are not discussions of how to give to the church or to support pastors with tithes.

Marinelli: Perhaps the percentage to give should be within the boundaries of Romans 14. If I feel the Spirit leading me to give more due to my prosperity, then I should give more.

Kelly: This is in agreement with 2 Cor 8:12-15 For if there be first a willing mind, it is accepted according to that a man hath, and not according to that he hath not.

13 For I mean not that other men be eased, and ye burdened:14 But by an equality, that now at this time your abundance may be a supply for their want, that their abundance also may be a supply for your want: that there may be equality:15 As it is written, He that had gathered much had nothing over; and he that had gathered little had no lack.

Marinelli: If I fail to heed the Spirit’s prompting, and thus violate my conscience and spend the money selfishly, then I sin — for anything apart from faith is sin.

Kelly: I agree.

Marinelli: Concerning the blessing of the tither/giver, I don’t advocate or agree with “cursed if you don’t tithe” preaching. We are redeemed from the curse of the Law (Gal 3:13) and free from the law of sin and death …

Kelly: I agree.

Marinelli: … 2 Corinthians 9 as well as Philippians 4:19 … The contexts of both of these passages pertain to the financial ministry to ministers, which is parallel to the giving of the tithe to support the priests in the Old Testament.

Kelly: No, they are not parallel to tithing in the Old Testament. (1) As a rabbi Paul had been taught that it was sin to be paid for teaching the Word (per many church historians). (2) The OT priesthood was replaced by the priesthood of every believer who do not tithe to themselves. (3) The Temple was replaced by the indwelling Holy Spirit, (4) the covenant vanished and the New Covenant was built on completely different principles and (5) the Levites ended as God’s workers.

Marinelli: The servants of the Old Testament (i.e. priests) were given monetary support for their services (Num 18:21, also see “meat in my house” in Mal 3:10).

Kelly: You err when you think that Num 18:21 refers to priests. It only refers to the servants of the priests who vaguely correspond to modern ushers, deacons, musicians, choir and politicians. Verses 25-28 and Neh 10:38 prove that the priests only received one tenth of one tenth, or one per cent of the tithe. This is not followed today.

Marinelli: Similarly, the New Testament places an emphasis on supplying the needs of New Testament ministers. 1 Corinthians 9:9-14 makes it abundantly clear.

Kelly: The only thing that 1 Cor 9:9-14 makes clear is that each vocation cares for its own according to its own principles. The Law used its Law principles in 9:13 and the Gospel has gospel principles of grace and faith in 9:14. If 9:13 is the only reference to 9:14 instead of 9:6-13, it would require gospel workers to copy ALL means of support for Levitical priests. This is not done.

Marinelli: If we sow sparingly in this area, we will reap sparingly financially (2 Cor 9:6), and vice versa. 2 Corinthians 9:7 does intimate that our giving should be done “cheerfully” (literally – hilariously) and not out of necessity.

Kelly: Again, 2 Cor 8 and 9 is not a discussion of church or pastoral support. T only deals with food for famine relief in Judea. Tithes are not involved or intimated. Also, Levitical tithing in the law as seen in Leviticus 27 and Numbers 18 is stone cold Law which must be obeyed whether one was cheerful or not. The two concepts of cheerful giving and Levitical tithing are not related in the Bible.

Marinelli: As long as our pastors, missionaries, and the poor are supported, then we are being led properly.

Kelly: Again there is a disconnect. OT tithes were never used to send out a single missionary to convert the Gentiles. The New Covenant uses sacrificial giving in the vein of Jesus Christ to motivate. It does not use Law.

Marinelli: Those with abundance should give to those who lack (See Acts 2:45, 4:35) — a situation which we are VERY far from unfortunately.

Kelly: Acts 2 and 4 are not examples of tithing because those same Jewish Christians continued to give their tithes to the Temple system per Acts 15 and 21:20-21.

Marinelli: There is no specific mention in the New Testament as to who the first fruits should be paid to.

Kelly: Yes, there certainly is. Read First Timothy 5:8. They go to buy medicine, food and essential shelter for your family.

Marinelli: Those with abundance should give to those who lack (See Acts 2:45, 4:35) — a situation which we are VERY far from unfortunately. God forgive us!!

Kelly: Again, this compares to sacrificial freewill giving as in 2 Cor 8:12-15 –not to tithing.

Russell Earl Kelly, PHD

www.tithing-russkelly.com
russell-kelly@att.net
www.tithing-russkelly.com
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Tithing-Study/

This is 2 of 33 Word of Faith responses from “Correcting the Cults – Expert responses to their scripture twisting” By Norman Geisler and Ron Rhodes. Bookmark the site and come back for this series. PART 1 IS HERE

1 Peter 1:18-19 — Is our redemption based on Christ suffering in hell, as some word of faith teachers argue, and not on His shedding of blood on the cross.

1Pe 1:18-19  Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers; But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:

Misinterpretation: Word-Faith teaches say that Christ shed blood on the cross did not atone for our sins. Kenneth Copeland, for example, says “Jesus went into hell to free mankind from the penalty of Adams high treason….When his blood poured out, it did not atone…. Jesus spent three horrible days and nights in the bowels of this earth getting back for you and me our rights with God.” (personal letter from Kenneth Copeland; cited in McConnell, 1988, 120).

Correcting the misinterpretation: We were redeemed says 1 Peter 1:19 “with the precious blood, as of a lamb unblemished and spotless, the blood of Christ.”,. In keeping with this, Ephesians 1:7 (nasb) states, “in Him we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of our trespasses, according to the riches of His grace.” Revelation 1:5 affirms that Christ has “released us from our sins by his blood“ (all nasb). Even the Old Testament pointed forward to Christ body being “pierced” (thereby shedding blood) for our iniquities (Isa. 53:5). Clearly our redemption is based on Christ shed blood. See the discussion of 2 Corinthians 5:21 for Old Testament background of blood Sacrifices.

It is highly significant that right before he died on the cross, Jesus stated, “It is finished” (Greek: tetelestai) (John 19:30). This word can also be translated “paid in full”. This was not a moan of defeat nor a sigh of patient resignation. Rather is was a triumphant recognition that Jesus had not fully accomplished what he had come into the world to do. The work of redemption was completed on the cross. Nothing further needed to be done. Jesus did not have to complete any of the redemption in hell. He paid the full price for our repletion on the cross. (2 Cor. 5:21).

For Scriptural arguments Refuting the idea that Jesus went to hell, See the discussion of Ephesians 4:9.